UHD New Releases, Reissues and Upgrades

[MichaelB]

Yes, totally agree. Curzon’s Jean Vigo discs look magnificent in SDR—and, crucially, they look like what I actually saw umpteen times in cinemas, aside from the rock steady and startlingly damage-free picture.

HDR can look great with the right material, but fetishising it as the be-all and end-all of a UHD presentation even when it really doesn’t suit the film is perverse to me.

[Zot!]

Surprised by the zoom in the picture. This clearly is the same master, so I wonder what justified zoomin in the selected framing 12 years later.

Ugh, so crap. The resolution is definitely a pleasing upgrade, but they've now cropped away enough picture information to invalidate the bump in pixels. From the sound of it this is the available 4K master regardless of the studio.

[rrenault]

So early word of mouth suggests Carlotta tops Vinegar Syndrome for its encode of The Tenant, although I’m guessing the latter wins on extras.

The Carlotta looks gorgeous. Unfortunately the English language track (which is my preferred version) comes with forced French subtitles which I can't get rid off and there are no English subs for the French audio. I had not realised French releases still did that in a time of region free UHD discs (I'm new to 4K/UHD).

I don’t think the subs are forced though on this disc. You should be able to turn them off with your remote even if you can’t via the disc menu.

[The Curious Sofa]

I just upgraded my whole system and the remote for my new Panasonic 4K player doesn't have a subtitle button. But I'll investigate further tonight.

[nicolas]

I think this is poor practice when everybody else has used HDR on SDR masters and it has been alright. No excuse for filtering all the life out of the audio or the cropping though so this is a huge letdown. Studiocanal need to come to the rescue.

There are just as many poor SDR-to-HDR “upgrades” as successful ones. Unless the application is really tasteful, you’re heightening the limits of the source (often blown-out highlights, limited shadow detail, etc.) and grain is typically exacerbated as well. Just look at Sony and Warner’s early 4Ks with their horrid 4000 nits+ torch mode grades. I think they’re all terrible and look grueling even on my high-end TV that tonemaps well but you don’t need as many nits to do more damage than good. As said, there are plenty great examples for the opposite, such as the 2K DI upscales in Criterion’s Wes Anderson 4K set but I applaud them for typically presenting SDR masters as originally finished.

I’d really recommend you trying great SDR 4Ks, such as The Wages of Fear, Yi Yi, I Know Where I’m Going. You’d be amazed at how faithful colors or the grayscales can be graded and film grain gently resolves into the highlights even without HDR. You’d be missing out on lots of good stuff.

[senseabove]

I just upgraded my whole system and the remote for my new Panasonic 4K player doesn't have a subtitle button. But I'll investigate further tonight.

You can get a better replacement remote with a subtitle button* on eBay. Look for one that also has the -10s and +60s skip buttons, too. The N2QAYA000130 is the one I've had for years now.

*unfortuantely it doesn't actually enable/cycle subtitles, just takes you to the menu, but that's better than of not having a button at all, like the standard remote

[TVC 15]

I think this is poor practice when everybody else has used HDR on SDR masters and it has been alright. No excuse for filtering all the life out of the audio or the cropping though so this is a huge letdown. Studiocanal need to come to the rescue.

There are just as many poor SDR-to-HDR “upgrades” as successful ones. Unless the application is really tasteful, you’re heightening the limits of the source (often blown-out highlights, limited shadow detail, etc.) and grain is typically exacerbated as well. Just look at Sony and Warner’s early 4Ks with their horrid 4000 nits+ torch mode grades. I think they’re all terrible and look grueling even on my high-end TV that tonemaps well but you don’t need as many nits to do more damage than good. As said, there are plenty great examples for the opposite, such as the 2K DI upscales in Criterion’s Wes Anderson 4K set but I applaud them for typically presenting SDR masters as originally finished.

I’d really recommend you trying great SDR 4Ks, such as The Wages of Fear, Yi Yi, I Know Where I’m Going. You’d be amazed at how faithful colors or the grayscales can be graded and film grain gently resolves into the highlights even without HDR. You’d be missing out on lots of good stuff.

I will take your word on that but it feels like Criterion were lazy here the way they never got the uncropped restoration and did not restore the audio. The filtering on the audio looks bad and there just is no reason for it when it was way better in the past from Studiocanal it is awful that we have to choose between better picture and worse audio or worse picture and way better audio.

[The Curious Sofa]

So early word of mouth suggests Carlotta tops Vinegar Syndrome for its encode of The Tenant, although I’m guessing the latter wins on extras.

The Carlotta looks gorgeous. Unfortunately the English language track (which is my preferred version) comes with forced French subtitles which I can't get rid off and there are no English subs for the French audio. I had not realised French releases still did that in a time of region free UHD discs (I'm new to 4K/UHD).

I don’t think the subs are forced though on this disc. You should be able to turn them off with your remote even if you can’t via the disc menu.

I rummaged round the settings and you are right, the subtitles can be turned off.

[hearthesilence]

We'll just have to agree to disagree on slapping an HDR grade on an SDR master. Color timing issues (Ritrovata, etc) aside, I think UHDs should be presented as close to the actual restoration as possible.

Same here. I think it's a misguided practice.

[nicolas]

I will take your word on that but it feels like Criterion were lazy here the way they never got the uncropped restoration and did not restore the audio. The filtering on the audio looks bad and there just is no reason for it when it was way better in the past from Studiocanal it is awful that we have to choose between better picture and worse audio or worse picture and way better audio.

I get what you mean but we’ll never know what happens in preparation of these releases. Maybe they tried, maybe they were denied or they didn’t bother regarding the aspect ratio. They managed to get better masters from Toho for their Kurosawa 4Ks, so I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt and speculate that they had to use what they were given by SC.

One thing’s for sure, they did work on the audio as you can see in the comparisons that were posted. Maybe not a revelation but to my eyes it looks as if they restored a significant amount of high-frequency detail in the international mix at the very least: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php? ... stcount=58.

[MichaelB]

I will take your word on that but it feels like Criterion were lazy here the way they never got the uncropped restoration and did not restore the audio. The filtering on the audio looks bad and there just is no reason for it when it was way better in the past from Studiocanal it is awful that we have to choose between better picture and worse audio or worse picture and way better audio.

I get what you mean but we’ll never know what happens in preparation of these releases. Maybe they tried, maybe they were denied or they didn’t bother regarding the aspect ratio. They managed to get better masters from Toho for their Kurosawa 4Ks, so I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt and speculate that they had to use what they were given by SC.

Obviously I have to declare a professional interest here, but there are few things that annoy me more than people using the word "lazy" when they don't have the faintest clue about what went on behind the scenes and couldn't be bothered to find out. Surely that's a rather better definition of true laziness?

While I can't comment on this specific instance, I can certainly confirm that there have been a great many occasions in my own experience where it's been a "take it or leave it" situation with regard to what the rightsholder supplies. Sometimes we have indeed opted for "leave it", but that's pretty rare given that money has usually been spent on the project which then has to be written off.

[TVC 15]

I will take your word on that but it feels like Criterion were lazy here the way they never got the uncropped restoration and did not restore the audio. The filtering on the audio looks bad and there just is no reason for it when it was way better in the past from Studiocanal it is awful that we have to choose between better picture and worse audio or worse picture and way better audio.

I get what you mean but we’ll never know what happens in preparation of these releases. Maybe they tried, maybe they were denied or they didn’t bother regarding the aspect ratio. They managed to get better masters from Toho for their Kurosawa 4Ks, so I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt and speculate that they had to use what they were given by SC.

One thing’s for sure, they did work on the audio as you can see in the comparisons that were posted. Maybe not a revelation but to my eyes it looks as if they restored a significant amount of high-frequency detail in the international mix at the very least: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php? ... stcount=58.

Little bit better but look how much more high frequency detail 2009 BFI has. 2009 BFI has lots more detail over 20 khz than even new Criterion. The bad thing about all of them is they all have a empty band where they wiped out all 15 khz frequencies which is terrible. Criterion might have done their best but this should be treated right by Studiocanal when they do their disc.

[MichaelB]

Have you personally listened to them? Do you genuinely think you'd be able to reliably pass a blind (or rather deaf) comparison test every time?

You keep using the excitable-teenager phrase "way better", but there's every possibility that in terms of where it matters—i.e. what it actually sounds like to a normal pair of human ears with a normal adult frequency response—there's very little practical difference.

[tenia]

I can't speak specifically for those, but Gaumont's titles used to be endemically filtered when restored, their soundtracks not carrying anything above 10 kHz when lucky, 7 kHz for the worst offenders. This IS absolutely audible. It makes the sound muffled and water-y to the point I ended up thinking "hell, French microphones were rubbish back then". It wasn't that, though, but the labs heavily filtering soundtracks.

This, however, is much more filtering than above 20 kHz, which is extremely likely not to be recognizable in a blind test. But what happened, say, on several Ozus to the point the BFI included older soundtracks ? Absolutely is.

[MichaelB]

Oh, of course, but that's filtering over and above merely eliminating anything above 15kHz (for instance, the appalling practice of trying to reduce hiss not just by EQ tweaking but by digitally eliminating it, which pretty much always sounds ghastly)—and I know exactly what that sounds like, as I've encountered it quite a few times when playing a master for the first time.

In which case I absolutely try to track down an alternative source (and thankfully have managed to on pretty much every occasion)—but the fact that Criterion didn't in this instance suggests that they most likely thought that it sounded fine.

[Finch]

Reports popping up elsewhere from early buyers of Severin's A Bay of Blood UHD that the Blu-Ray with the Italian cut keeps freezing at 28 minutes and 37 seconds, and at other intervals past that. This happened on different players. They've already alerted Severin.

[Finch]

Kiss of the Spiderwoman UHD Chris' review

[nicolas]

The Dead (Criterion) - my impressions. In short: Fantastic restoration, beautifully graded with tasteful HDR and solid encoding. 4.0 audio is brilliantly detailed, rich and spacious without audible filtering or processing. The film on the BD and the BTS doc look excellent as well.

That Kiss of the Spider Woman restoration looks just as stunning in Chris’ caps. Criterion’s doing very impressive work at the moment.

[TVC 15]

Have you personally listened to them? Do you genuinely think you'd be able to reliably pass a blind (or rather deaf) comparison test every time?

You keep using the excitable-teenager phrase "way better", but there's every possibility that in terms of where it matters—i.e. what it actually sounds like to a normal pair of human ears with a normal adult frequency response—there's very little practical difference.

Not for this but it is not hard for me to hear the differences on other tracks that have had the same thing done to them. When I am paying more money for an upgraded format than I expect it to be done better than before. Does not look like filtered to death like the terrible Searchers track but more like Under Siege that had filtering and removed 15 khz frequencies too. I heard the difference easily when tested against my DVD and LD.

[Finch]

That color grade on the Married 4K is definitely overload. But it'll do until Radiance or another UK label hopefully addresses that. (Ditto Southern Comfort which Second Sight still haven't upgraded)

Married is such tremendous fun and perfect casting. I completely forgot even supporting bits like Chris Isaak as a fries and burger serving clown assassin, and they show deleted scene snippets as the end credits roll, another nice touch.

[mfunk9786]

Leaving Las Vegas (Shout)

What an excellent film this is - and yeah, the restoration is revelatory, all the neon is handled precisely as you'd expect it to be, without going crazy on the peak brightness in HDR. Would highly recommend the Shout disc.

[nicolas]

Blue Velvet (Plaion) - subtle improvement to the Criterion in encoding and audio (2.0)

[TVC 15]

Blue Velvet (Plaion) - subtle improvement to the Criterion in encoding and audio (2.0)

It says Trainspotting in audio link for Criterion 4k is that just a mistitle or is it wrong track? 4/4 Trainspotting one looks like Criterion Blu-ray but filtered and Plaion Blu-ray looks different from both like it was a different movie. If OG 2.0 is better and colours look a little more natural then this beats Criterion easy.

[hearthesilence]

Extremely subtle difference in the encoding. I do see it but honestly it feels miniscule. (FWIW I had to zoom in on each image, then open them in a different tab or window to get the complete 4K size. It needed those two steps, just one didn't do it.) The only place where it might stand out for me is the sky above Beaumont's, and I have a feeling they chose to degrain it a bit because it does look especially granular on the Plaion screen cap.

[nicolas]

It says Trainspotting in audio link for Criterion 4k is that just a mistitle or is it wrong track? 4/4 Trainspotting one looks like Criterion Blu-ray but filtered and Plaion Blu-ray looks different from both like it was a different movie. If OG 2.0 is better and colours look a little more natural then this beats Criterion easy.

Criterion’s encoder labeled the Blue Velvet 4K as Trainspotting. I didn’t bother changing this when I made the comparison but used the correct identifiers on slow.pics.

I commented on the audio here: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php? ... tcount=110