Vinegar Syndrome and Their Partner Labels

[TechnicolorAcid]

Chelsea Girls?

I’m not sure that has a director’s cut though so it’s probably not that.

[TVC15]

I think the Cinematographe that’s due on Black Friday is bound to Minnie & Moskowitz not only because one of the hints specifically because it’s been established it’s now the oldest film in the lineup (Thieves Like Us was from ‘74) but the newsletter taunts a long-lost director’s cut of the film (Cassevetes’ cut had an opening scene removed which never appeared in a DVD release). So I think M&M is in the bag.

That's a comedy though and the 2 art teases they've released so far look bleak and gloomy

[MichaelB]

That's a comedy though and the 2 art teases they've released so far look bleak and gloomy

Have you actually seen it? I mean, it's lighter than the average Cassavetes but it's hardly a riotous thigh-slapper.

[luxta]

Maybe Badge 373 had some director's cut, who knows. Neo-noir, New York, rain, neon signs...

[beamish14]

Maybe De Palma’s The Black Dahlia? It’s an hour shorter than what he had wanted

Edit: totally forgot about the period its from

[luxta]

Coming soon \:D/

[dwk]

The Keep (UHD)
Sliver (UHD)
Women on the Run (VSA)
Neither the Sea Nor the Sand (VSL)
Who Killed Teddy Bear (UHD)(Cinematographe)
Alexandra (Quality X)
The Passions of Carol (Quality X)

[ryannichols7]

I know I shouldn't be the one to say this, but after all this wait time for Goodbar and The Keep, those were the best covers they could do?

[beamish14]

No deleted scenes from The Keep or Sliver, which has one of the most infamous and well-documented alternate endings ever? Talk about let-downs

[MichaelB]

I assumed The Keep would be barebones, and so I was very pleasantly surprised that there were any extras at all. But I'd have been astonished if there was any deleted footage, because presumably such a thing would require Michael Mann's permission, and he's made it very clear that he wants nothing to do with the film any more.

[Calvin]

I assumed The Keep would be barebones, and so I was very pleasantly surprised that there were any extras at all. But I'd have been astonished if there was any deleted footage, because presumably such a thing would require Michael Mann's permission, and he's made it very clear that he wants nothing to do with the film any more.

Is it not the case that they would have needed Michael Mann's permission anyway? Certainly when Kino licensed it, the reason they gave for dropping it was that, under DGA rules, Mann's consent would need to be given for a new transfer to be made and he was blocking this from happening.

Which is why I'm surprised this was happening at all! I think some folks got excited from this tweet (or whatever we call them now) where it appears Paramount had done something with a workprint.

[luxta]

From Blu forum:

If a director doesn't want to approve a new master then it can still be done without their input. DGA rules allow directors to have input on home video releases and the transfer itself but it doesn't give them the power to prevent studios from remastering and releasing their own films.

[tenia]

Interesting. I always thought it was kinda mandatory (except, of course, if the director explicitely states people can go ahead without its input).

[MichaelB]

France is a lot tougher when it comes to the author's moral rights, so it might have been more of a challenge doing it there (assuming Mann didn't give permission).

[jazzo]

For those who have never seen The Keep, I recommend checking it out before blind-buying the release. As young tweens when this was first released, I and my horror/fantasy-loving friends (who had even read and enjoyed the F. Paul Wilson source novel) were hoping this was going to be a revelation when we were finally able to get the VHS for a movie night, and we were left absolutely befuddled at the complete and utter mess the film seemed to be.

I revisited it as an adult a few years ago, hoping that I simply wasn't old enough to appreciate it charms, but I thought it was absolutely fucking terrible (and not, I might add, in the wonderful almost outsider artist way that many of those 80s genre films are). It doesn't surprise me that Mann wants to disown the picture. That being said, I know it has its fans and I'm happy a nice edition finally exists for them. But for anyone without a nostalgic glow for the film, approach with caution and check those expectations. Great Tangerine Dream score, though.

And I suppose I have to ask, are the genre nerds now so desperate that they're reclaiming Sliver, for fuck's sake?

[domino harvey]

And I suppose I have to ask, are the genre nerds now so desperate that they're reclaiming Sliver, for fuck's sake?

There is an enormous portion of physical media buyers who will simply buy anything they ever remember appearing on cable in the 80s or 90s. Literally anything. Once you realize this, a lot of these releases start making (financial) sense

[senseabove]

The big news here, honestly, is the never-before-released uncensored Who Killed Teddy Bear?

[jazzo]

And I suppose I have to ask, are the genre nerds now so desperate that they're reclaiming Sliver, for fuck's sake?

There is an enormous portion of physical media buyers who will simply buy anything they ever remember appearing on cable in the 80s or 90s. Literally anything. Once you realize this, a lot of these releases start making (financial) sense

Wasn't it Karl Lagerfeld who once said, "Cable films from the 80s and 90s are a sign of defeat. You lost control of your life so you bought high end physical media releases of those cable films"?

Or maybe that was sweatpants (he wrote, himself, owning plenty of high end releases of shitty films on physical media, and a pair of sweatpants [for sleeping]).

[tenia]

France is a lot tougher when it comes to the author's moral rights, so it might have been more of a challenge doing it there (assuming Mann didn't give permission).

I meant : I thought the DGA rules in the US was making that mandatory.
Here, I think that there are also right issues in general on the movie anyway.

[Calvin]

I've round Kino's post on the matter circa May 22.

Nothing strange about it, due to DGA (Director's Guild of America) rules, no new HD/2K/4K master can be created without the consent of the director.

Any US label could've released the old SD master on DVD, but neither KL or the label who acquired it after us were interested in a DVD ONLY release.

It seems strange that they would have been so misinformed if that's not the case

[ryannichols7]

From Blu forum:

If a director doesn't want to approve a new master then it can still be done without their input. DGA rules allow directors to have input on home video releases and the transfer itself but it doesn't give them the power to prevent studios from remastering and releasing their own films.

I was gonna ask if this was the case, how did Kino releasing Lost Highway not gain more traction, but I'm guessing that's different since Kino was sublicensing it from Universal, whereas Criterion licensed it directly from MK2. but also begs the question about Arrow releasing Dune seemingly without any director involvement at all. hm

And I suppose I have to ask, are the genre nerds now so desperate that they're reclaiming Sliver, for fuck's sake?

There is an enormous portion of physical media buyers who will simply buy anything they ever remember appearing on cable in the 80s or 90s. Literally anything. Once you realize this, a lot of these releases start making (financial) sense

and what's worse is that they're willing to pay top dollar for the slop too. I can't help but notice once again that this label is being scalper friendly with the "limit two per customer" - one to watch, one to sit in the plastic wrap and eventually sell on eBay fo $$$ I'm sure. I'm sure the argument is "we're letting them buy gifts" but...I don't see any of these movies being gifts

[luxta]

The Keep: "inventory_quantity": 3769. And continues...

[luxta]

and what's worse is that they're willing to pay top dollar for the slop too.

Do you consider yourself elite?

Personally, I am omnivorous because I love different types of cinema and I know how to separate the wheat from the chaff. Today I can watch the slasher Doom Asylum, and tomorrow Bergman's Persona.

[ryannichols7]

and what's worse is that they're willing to pay top dollar for the slop too.

Do you consider yourself elite?

Personally, I am omnivorous because I love different types of cinema and I know how to separate the wheat from the chaff.

I'm not saying I'm elite (I have paid for a few of those Warner tat editions from the UK of Singin' in the Rain and Casablanca) but I do think there's a clear quality separation sometimes. I respect that this cinema has a place for a lot of people (as I've said elsewhere in this thread) and that it does help keep a healthy physical media market...but the high priced, pro-scalping stuff is dangerous to that market too. luckily even though Imprint/Via Vision kinda caught onto it (not sure if they were successful with their Labyrinth and Neverending Story experiments?), the UK labels don't seem interested in it at all. and we don't expect Criterion or Kino to do the same, for better and worse

[dwk]

I was gonna ask if this was the case, how did Kino releasing Lost Highway not gain more traction, but I'm guessing that's different since Kino was sublicensing it from Universal, whereas Criterion licensed it directly from MK2. but also begs the question about Arrow releasing Dune seemingly without any director involvement at all. hm

Lost Highway had an existing HD master (created for the DVD) that Kino used because Lynch wouldn't agree to supervise a new transfer (clearly because he was getting the rights back just a year or two after Kino licensed the film and why ruin the value of a future release.)

Dune's transfer was done by one of the German labels, so they may have gotten around his involvement that way (or he didn't care about supervising/approving the transfer) but it wouldn't surprise me if Lynch was the reason that Arrow was not able to include the various unauthorized cuts.