ThomasPashko wrote: Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:22 pm
Here's a weird question, and apologies if this has been answered in the preceding years of this thread:
So, I recently picked up the new Criterion Blu-ray, and am listening to the selected scene commentaries by Vlada Petric (these were recorded in 1998 for the old edition, but I never listened to them very attentively on that disc). In the scene where we see the crucifixion/passion play in the snow, Petric repeatedly refers to Christ in this scene as "Kirill." Are we supposed to infer that this is a passion play where Jesus is played by the ex-monk Kirill (Ivan Lapikov)!? If so, that changes the meaning of this scene pretty drastically, but I don't think that's right. The actor on screen has similarly styled hair and beard to Kirill, but it doesn't look like Lapikov to me. Also, IMDb lists the actor Igor Donskoy as playing "Khristos" (Christ), and I can't think of anyone that could refer to other than the Christ in the crucifixion/passion play. Is Petric just wrong here? Or am I misunderstanding what he's saying?
You're right; Petric does refer to Donskoy as Kirill. When I picked up the latest edition of Rublev I deliberately avoided the Petric commentary as I found it wooden, redundant and rather laborsome when I initially listened to it on the older one. He also tends read overtly Christian symbolism into scenes that, to my mind, are most potent in their spiritual ambiguity.
One thing I noticed, more with the latest edition for some reason, is Tarkovsky's habit of tossing birds in front of the camera when "establishing" a scene. Somewhere I read that T did this in an overhead shot of a village center just to give the view some perspective. But he also does this when Rublev begins to spy on the pagan night ritual where this rationale seems unnecessary.
connor wrote: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:44 pm
I've been avoiding this film actually due to this scene, which sounds pretty horrifying. Is it included in the 185 minute cut?
The first half of the shot is in the current Director's Cut version, showing the horse falling off a flight of stairs. The horse is bleeding very badly, clearly gravely wounded. The full length shot, in THE PASSION OF ANDREI, continues after the fall, and goes on to a much more graphic picture of the horse's actual demise. It's not for the faint of heart. It's easily skipped, if you know what to watch out for.
Ironically, scenes like that just serve to take me out of the film, imaginatively speaking. The opposite of the intended effect.
I take your point but for me the film suffers without the cut violence. I love Rublev, and also Stalker, but they are 'hard going' experiences, and the violent scenes jar so much that they leaven the viewing.
ando wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 12:11 amOne thing I noticed, more with the latest edition for some reason, is Tarkovsky's habit of tossing birds in front of the camera when "establishing" a scene. Somewhere I read that T did this in an overhead shot of a village center just to give the view some perspective. But he also does this when Rublev begins to spy on the pagan night ritual where this rationale seems unnecessary.
Wouldn't surprise me if the birds were something specifically inspired by Bruegel, a lot of the mise-en-scene in Rublev feels not too far afield from Bruegel.
ando wrote: Wed Jan 16, 2019 12:11 amOne thing I noticed, more with the latest edition for some reason, is Tarkovsky's habit of tossing birds in front of the camera when "establishing" a scene. Somewhere I read that T did this in an overhead shot of a village center just to give the view some perspective. But he also does this when Rublev begins to spy on the pagan night ritual where this rationale seems unnecessary.
There is obviously a strong link between the natural world and the story in Andrei Rublev and I'd say the "bird shot" ends up having different intensions at different points. The Pagan scene for example I felt helped create a more dreamlike atmosphere and perhaps playing up the link between the them and the woodland around them being roused by their ceremony. The slow mo shot during the tartar raid though has ducks used and I think plays up the sense of panic with their struggling to fly not in their preferred environment.
Calvin wrote: Wed Sep 07, 2022 11:46 am
Andrei Rublev is one of the films that Mosfilm have put up on their YouTube channel in 4K UHD
I'm skeptical. The transfer they provided to Criterion was not 4k and I'm dubious they made a new one since then for streaming. I've seen a number of "4k" films on the Mosfilm youtube channel that were definite upscales.
It seems they're having War and Peace in 4k there too, but Criterion's specs were 2k restoration and I doubt there's been a newer one since this release (though maybe I missed it).
I wouldn't be surprised if they were just upscaling the 2K restorations to 4K. A lot of the Fortune Star titles that have received 2K restorations show up on iTunes as 4K with Dolby Vision.
solaris72 wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 3:22 pm
I'm skeptical. The transfer they provided to Criterion was not 4k and I'm dubious they made a new one since then for streaming. I've seen a number of "4k" films on the Mosfilm youtube channel that were definite upscales.
The transfer that Criterion used for the blu release isn't even the restored version. They originally said they were going to use the 2K restorations but then they quietly changed the specs to the old HD master.
Calvin wrote: Wed Sep 07, 2022 11:46 am
Andrei Rublev is one of the films that Mosfilm have put up on their YouTube channel in 4K UHD
I'm skeptical. The transfer they provided to Criterion was not 4k and I'm dubious they made a new one since then for streaming. I've seen a number of "4k" films on the Mosfilm youtube channel that were definite upscales.
You're right, it's the same HD restoration from 2004 that Criterion used, says so in the end credits. While uploading these upscales as 4K may be justifiable due to YouTube's compression being less terrible in 4K vs 1080p, putting these "4K" banners is not.
The interesting thing is that Andrei Rublev actually has been recently restored in 4K and it's the longer cut, The Passion According to Andrei. It premiered on TV in August and will be shown in Russian cinemas in November, probably not any time soon in the US for obvious reasons. (both links in Russian)
Andrei Rublev – Director’s Cut
By Andrei Tarkovsky (USSR, 1966, 191 minutes, Color/B/W)
Restored by: Istituto Internazionale Andrei Tarkovsky in collaboration with Coevolutions and Cloudpost
According to a blu-ray forum poster, this is a new cut prepared by Tarkovsky's son. Supposedly the son talks about it in this youtube video, but it's in Italian.
solaris72 wrote: Sat Jul 22, 2023 4:33 pm…According to a blu-ray forum poster, this is a new cut prepared by Tarkovsky's son. Supposedly the son talks about it in this youtube video, but it's in Italian.
Thanks. Though it looks like the Italian speaking panel is actually discussing a restoration of Nostalghia, which makes sense as that film was shot in Italy.
solaris72 wrote: Sat Jul 22, 2023 4:33 pm…According to a blu-ray forum poster, this is a new cut prepared by Tarkovsky's son. Supposedly the son talks about it in this youtube video, but it's in Italian.
Thanks. Though it looks like the Italian speaking panel is actually discussing a restoration of Nostalghia, which makes sense as that film was shot in Italy.
Yeah- they said that the Rublev cut was mentioned at the start of the video, but no idea if that's true.
Wasn't it supposed to be released in the UK until Criterion released it would run afoul of animal cruelty laws there and they weren't prepared to cut it? Adding Region B for the second pressing would make sense so region-locked Europeans could import it.
Yes, that is what happened. Unfortunately they didn't get a new UPC, so if an etailer has/had mixed stock one could possibly get the region locked 1st pressing.
I watched both versions this weekend and really wish they would have put a but more effort into the 205 minute version’s transfer. I think u prefer that version of the film.
