Knives Outs (Rian Johnson, 2019-2025)

[Zot!]

I'm afraid I only lasted for 25 or so minutes watching this along with my wife. It just wasn't making me care at all about anything that was going on. So no mini-review will be forthcoming from me....

Same here. I've not seen the original, but I am confounded how pug-faced 007 (poorly) channeling Foghorn Leghorn in a seersucker bathing costume (complete with ascot!) could possibly pass as a characterization, much less a central character for two feature films. I made it as far the set-up from The Game with a bunch of idiotic and immediately tiresome Wacky Races stereotypes, and soon punted.

[brundlefly]

the sight of Daniel Craig playing Among Us with some recently deceased theater luminaries still lands with a whiff of desperate relevance-chasing that the structure of a potboiler doesn't even demand. Why include anything about the pandemic if the film doesn't play off the safety-unsafety dichotomy it introduces, and why is the worldly and class-conscious Benoit Blanc a celeb-focused starfucker?

You may have seen and still dismissed it as distracting and desperate but

Spoiler

…the inclusion of Lansbury and Sondheim is at least being marketed(*) as genuine fanboy enthusiasm. It’s not out of Blanc’s (or Johnson’s) character – as that article mentions, Blanc is singing Sondheim in Knives Out – and his online compatriots may be celebrities but are also all high-profile puzzlers. Lansbury and Lyonne are both TV detectives, the latter in Johnson’s own forthcoming Poker Face (which may or may not be the result of the online push to land her in a Columbo reboot,) Abdul-Jabbar and Sondheim are both mystery writers. (Sondheim also has ties to your beloved Sleuth.) That round of celebrity cameos struck me as nothing more or less than the same embedded self-involvement that saw Nathan Fillion playing poker with James Patterson and Dennis Lahane on Castle. Part and parcel of contemporary potboiler stuff.

(*) Lyonne’s quote about her composited scene partners at the bottom of this is typical gold.

(As far as the cameos go, Ethan Hawke was a ?, but Serena Williams spoke giggly to casual moneyed access and Yo-Yo Ma (beyond puzzlebox functionality) had me gleefully wondering at how much fun Yo-Yo Ma’s personal life may well be.)

But then I don’t see these movies as more than concertedly clever exercises where viewers are encouraged to share in the self-amusement. Think very hard but don’t think too much. Join the Easter Egg hunt. Didn’t find its politics in either film more than sympathetic playdress, so satirical shots that land broad instead of deep feel right. The Knives Out films are not going to volunteer at the local food bank, but they will round up their supermarket purchases to the next dollar and donate that difference. Not as an excuse, but I suspect the pandemic material simply sprung from the environment in which the film was conceived (and provided easy populist jabs at the do-mask crowds too often caught partying maskless.)

I guess I’m in the minority, but I did not mind the sluggish introductory hour, but then I also like Norm Macdonald jokes, and I felt that hour wove its exposition in the form of a set-up for

Spoiler

Blanc’s quick-hit crowd-pleasing punchline solution to Bron’s (and hired hand Gillian Flynn’s) dinner theater. It’s of a piece that its satire might be obvious and toothless but the mechanics would be elaborate.

Where it did drag for me was the long, long redress/reveal. I didn’t resent the switcheroo, and both elements are functions of this sort of thing, but it felt like a real-time do-over that needed either more substantial revelations or fun in-jokes.

Hahn is terrible in this, and I wonder how much that’s a result of having a character that both has nothing to do and makes little sense in the environment. She’s hung out to dry. But I thought Hudson was at least occasionally glorious. Maybe sometimes only visually so. But it’s a cartoon role, she’s game for it, and putting her with/against Henwick (who’s underused) is shrewd.

Spoiler

Their work is I think what makes that joke about the sweatshops explode before Henwick gets past, “Please don’t tell me you thought…”

[soundchaser]

Hahn is the weakest link of the bunch, but I also found Odom curiously backgrounded a lot of the time. Most of the side roles (with the exception of Bautista and Cline) feel underwritten -- which is a problem in a film this purposefully claustrophobic.

[therewillbeblus]

Join the Easter Egg hunt.

This was a brilliant subtle inclusion in a film that doesn't have many. Nice appreciation, I agree that Hudson's character and her residual punchlines work well - though my experience seeing it in a packed theatre should be credited. I'm afraid many people will judge this film for not working, when the overstated bits may have if only viewed under the 'right' conditions (and most likely the theatrical ones they saw the first film under). Having said all that, I really like Never Cursed's point about the heartening role Monae/de Armas play in relation to Blanc, and I also thought Hahn and Odom Jr. had little to do. But (and I feel a bit like I'm setting myself up to be gaslit by saying this), Hahn isn't super silly or over the top or anything here, is she? I went in expecting some loud, gratingly comedic perf from her, but all we got was a "serious" one from a non-character who doesn't really need to exist here (any statement being made about influenced politicians is never actually made or built upon the general idea of). What did I miss (twice)?

[Swift]

Join the Easter Egg hunt.

This was a brilliant subtle inclusion in a film that doesn't have many.

In addition to that bit of costuming, Johnson revealed in his Vanity Fair YouTube video that Craig worked with the costume designer to create a hybrid of Jacques Tati and Cary Grant in To Catch a Thief with his attire.

[brundlefly]

And I hope there are more subtle inclusions! Unfortunately my main memories of Knives Out – how high did Lionsgate amp the licensing so Netflix balked at hosting it when Blanc 2 premiered? – don’t go beyond my gut takeaways (Clever! Often fun! Well-meaning and ultimately hollow!), but those were buoyed by online post-mortems. Gosh, that baseball device was keen. I haven’t been looking, but I hope there’s enough in Glass Onion to get amateur sleuths pull their heads out of conspiracyville and make some useful contribution to society for a stretch.

But (and I feel a bit like I'm setting myself up to be gaslit by saying this), Hahn isn't super silly or over the top or anything here, is she? I went in expecting some loud, gratingly comedic perf from her, but all we got was a "serious" one from a non-character who doesn't really need to exist here (any statement being made about influenced politicians is never actually made or built upon the general idea of). What did I miss (twice)?

A lot of it’s exactly what you say: There’s no character there, no angle/personality on the target, but she ticks the delivery up a notch or two on every line. Near the start of the film her character’s sarcastically mocking Birdie’s overdramatic tone, but at some point she starts competing with it. She’s inflating nothing and It winds up arch noise. Odom is at least low-key, so I can just feel bad for him. But then Annette Bening is often terrible in Branagh’s often terrible Death on the Nile(which also btw spends its full first hour on introduction/exposition). She stays on 10 in every tiny scene she’s in and you start to dread seeing her. Ensembles are delicate ecosystems and it’s probably unfair to call out the performers.

Agree with you and NC about Blanc’s need for

Spoiler

a Watson, at least thus far, though I’m given to bristle at any shade of vigilantism or the extra-legal activity that NC suggests as necessary. (I don’t find the ending of Glass Onion any more convincing than a standard hand-off to the police, but it is smashy and has a fun punchline.) One of the draws and drawbacks of these things is that they are so talky; Blanc isn’t going to get his hands dirty, but then he’s not going to do anything with his hands beyond gesticulate. So having a partner who will actually act (double-meaning, in this case) puts some movement in the movie. And of course the choices of partners so far have made him more emotionally complete as well. Knowing who the partner is robs Blanc of some agency/misdirection, but I do not know how often that device would be sustainable and thought the suggestion at the end of Onion that Monae will stay on a welcome one.

[Murdoch]

Johnson sure loves his celebrity name-dropping in this.

I thought Glass Onion was a fun diversion but a step down from its predecessor. The characters, outside of Monae's and Craig's, were poorly drawn. Batista's character, a far-right misogynist in his 50s, being a top Twitch streamer was laughable on a platform dominated by Gen Z and millennial gamers. Hahn's politician had little depth or substance, same with Odom's scientist, whose background feels like a footnote. The only one of the potential suspects to get much to do was Hudson's washed-up model.

Spoiler

I didn't much like the midway shift from developing the suspects to revealing Monae's hidden identity. I'm not sure why Johnson structured the film this way. Perhaps because postponing the reveal of Monae's identity to the end would have involved an explanation that would take too long and detract from the twist. Regardless, once that shift happened, the mystery of the film vanished for me and the film likewise gave up on withholding anything from the viewer. An interesting technique but a dull one for a mystery film.

The final, destructive scene was underwhelming but clever in how it turned the line about the Mona Lisa on its head. Although I would expect the French government to do an extremely thorough investigation of the destruction of the world's most treasured piece of art so I find it hard to believe that Monae would completely escape culpability for it. It's not as if Hahn & co. are particularly reliable people, especially under pressure, and they're all still financially beholden to Norton.

The first film was a bit too self-serious for me, so I was happy to see this one drop that for something more playful. Still, it left a lot to be desired.

[therewillbeblus]

Spoiler

I didn't much like the midway shift from developing the suspects to revealing Monae's hidden identity. I'm not sure why Johnson structured the film this way. Perhaps because postponing the reveal of Monae's identity to the end would have involved an explanation that would take too long and detract from the twist. Regardless, once that shift happened, the mystery of the film vanished for me and the film likewise gave up on withholding anything from the viewer. An interesting technique but a dull one for a mystery film.

Spoiler

It wasn't a novel structure, but one deliberately aping Gone Girl's reveal one-hour in, and plenty of other films by the likes of Almodóvar et al. have done the same, to anything-but dull results! The twist also did happen at the end (as far as the present-day narrative goes, at least). We interrupt the final scene of the plot to get the long backstory, recontextualizing scenes up until we return to Craig's final speech and then she enters. Revealing her identity is crucial to develop the character- otherwise we'd have a crew of thin stereotypes without the de Armas-equivalent to anchor audience investment. I can understand a lot of criticisms against this film, but I find it strange to identify the structure as problematic, or even "interesting" for the genre, since it is pretty well-established for mystery films

[Murdoch]

Spoiler

My memory of Gone Girl is limited as it didn't leave much of an impression on me, and the few Almodovars I've seen I can't remember well enough to speak to their similarity to this.

I just didn't find the early reveal of Monae particularly captivating, and for me it was at that point that the film fell apart, as I realized Johnson wasn't interested in developing the "thin stereotypes" that populated its mystery any further.

[domino harvey]

Knives Out 3 is even more embarrassingly named after a song, this time U2’s “Wake Up Dead Man”…

[The Narrator Returns]

As a staunch Pop defender going on 15 years, this is a great moment of high-profile vindication, though the movie would need to be a towering bummer to live up to the song.

[Fiery Angel]

at least he's not naming the sequels "Hey Jude" or "With or Without You"

[TechnicolorAcid]

Calling it now, if we get to 9 installments it’s going to be about an investigation into the death of an arrogant revolutionary called Revolution 9.

[bad future]

Love how the naming scheme has turned the first one from "common phrase that Radiohead also used for a song title" to "very likely named after a Radiohead song"

[Kracker]

and they're still not letting him call it "A Benoît Blanc Mystery"

[brundlefly]

Coming December 12th.

[brundlefly]

Teaser.

[therewillbeblus]

Wake Up Dead Man is another strong entry in the series, playing around with a more varied test of narrative devices, for better or worse; mostly inspired, occasionally sloppy. Josh O'Connor is the real deal, quite funny here as he demonstrates how he can show up for both art films and mainstream appeal. Brolin also continues to exhibit his strengths for comedy as the cantankerous fellow priest. The rest of the cast is okay, but almost everyone feels like a wasted, thin character, except for Close as the icy allegiant to Brolin. I'm clearly at-odds with many fans by finding Glass Onion to be the best of the series, but I suspect that most of its haters will appreciate the toned-down sociopolitical content and Blanc being primarily resigned to goofy-reaction physical comedy rather than planted as the story's central figure. It's also arguably the deepest film of the bunch, a welcome touch even though we're not here for that. I dunno, at first I was dismissive of Knives Out. I missed Johnson in a more serious creative mood. But I'm starting to really enjoy his light, fluffy, pure fun projects, and I kinda hope he keeps cranking these out along with Poker Face seasons if the ideas are there. I just wish he'd give his supporting casts more to do, especially when he's going to hire such talent

[Yakushima]

Wake Up Dead Man is a pure delight and is easily my favorite movie of the year - by far! Rian Johnson is true to form.
It is ridiculous though how hard it was to find a theater that plays it. I had to drive 40 minutes to a small arthouse theater, the only place that had it in my corner of New Jersey. No major theaters here seem to be showing it for some reason. But the effort was well worth it.
By the way, the Saturday 2PM matinee screening was completely sold out, and there was a line for the next show when I was exiting. Netflix is losing a ton of money by having such a limited theatrical run.

[brundlefly]

Wake Up Dead Man is a pure delight and is easily my favorite movie of the year - by far! Rian Johnson is true to form.
It is ridiculous though how hard it was to find a theater that plays it. I had to drive 40 minutes to a small arthouse theater, the only place that had it in my corner of New Jersey. No major theaters here seem to be showing it for some reason. But the effort was well worth it.
By the way, the Saturday 2PM matinee screening was completely sold out, and there was a line for the next show when I was exiting. Netflix is losing a ton of money by having such a limited theatrical run.

I'm in Central Jersey and have four theaters playing it in my area. Not in the major chains, but at least there are more options than Netflix gave me for Frankenstein.

[Yakushima]

I'm in Central Jersey and have four theaters playing it in my area. Not in the major chains, but at least there are more options than Netflix gave me for Frankenstein.

Glad to hear from a fellow New Jersean and that you had more options! For us it was choosing between The Clairidge in Montclair or going to Staten Island or New York.

[brundlefly]

Now that Netflix has Sesame Street, it can serve synergistic function there. So: Beignet Blanc in "Forks Out."

[knives]

I’m probably the last person feeling this way, but I absolutely loved the newest movie.

[Noiretirc]

I’m probably the last person feeling this way, but I absolutely loved the newest movie.

Knives out!

[Noiretirc]

at least he's not naming the sequels "Hey Jude" or "With or Without You"

There's likely more coming, right?

I absolutely loved the first film. These sequels completely flew under the radar for me. No theaters near me are showing Wake Up Dead Man.