88 Films

[swo17]

I think they were clearly not trying to make a statement by starting to work with him. Otherwise they would have "stood their ground" instead of quickly dropping him. Perhaps this is too low of a bar, but in a world where the former POTUS still won't admit that he completely fabricated the idea of a stolen election, which has cost actual human lives, this feels like a relative win and/or something that should barely even register as news

[Computer Raheem]

I think they were clearly not trying to make a statement by starting to work with him. Otherwise they would have "stood their ground" instead of quickly dropping him. Perhaps this is too low of a bar, but in a world where the former POTUS still won't admit that he completely fabricated the idea of a stolen election, which has cost actual human lives, this feels like a relative win and/or something that should barely even register as news

I guess, in the grand scheme of things, it isn't a political statement working with him; my cynicism probably got the better of me. Still would have been preferable if they didn't work with him to begin with, but that ship has long past

[therewillbeblus]

I can think of so many mistakes that would have been preferable if I didn't make them in the past too. All of them actually

[Marlew]

I take the statement at face value. Their focus was on getting the most supplementary features for their releases, no matter where they came from. They don't apologise, they only acknowledge that they were naive, i.e. They failed to predict the audience response.

Likewise, I think they've failed to predict how people will respond to this statement.

[Maltic]

.. and btw what is Tsui Hark up to these days?

He was one of the three co-directors (along with Chen Kaige and Dante Lam) on last year's Korean War extravaganza The Battle of Lake Changjin (i.e., Chosin Reservoir). The same three are credited for this year's sequel, but Tsui directed about 90% of it. He also directed one of the better segments of the perhaps inevitably underwhelming omnibus Septet, a mostly amusing comedy bit about a near-future mental institution where the patients (and doctors?) all claim to be famous HK film figures.

Thanks for the update. I guess I meant it as a rhetorical question. Leeder apparently supports the CCP, but then Tsui directs essentially CCP propaganda and the labels aren't dropping him (not saying they should).

[Mr Sausage]

Tsui has made Chinese nationalist propaganda films for decades, since at least the Once Upon a Time in China films.

[Maltic]

To the point

[Mr Sausage]

To the point

?

[Maltic]

Just saying it seems hard to avoid people who support the CCP (to one degree or another) when it comes to HK cinema

[The Fanciful Norwegian]

Where did you find out who directed what in Battle of Lake Changjin? The second part of the film definitely had more of Tsui's touch to it, even if it was just endless battle scenes.

Producer Yu Dong said it at the pre-release press conference. Chen Kaige was also present and said he only directed about five minutes of the film, mainly the ending. The movie itself actually credits Tsui as the sole director, even though the publicity materials still have Chen and Lam as co-directors.

[beamish14]

I’d love to see more of Chen Kaige’s films get HD releases. Caught in the Web was streaming for a while on Amazon, but it’s now MIA. I saw a new 35mm print of Yellow Earth at least 7 years ago, but it’s never had more than a VHS in North America. Together has a 20+ year old DVD master

[pistolwink]

Tsui has made Chinese nationalist propaganda films for decades, since at least the Once Upon a Time in China films.

Many Chinese films made in HK have a sort of generic nationalism, sometimes even alluding, usually metaphorically, to a hoped-for reunion between mainland China and HK and Taiwan (as in the ending of Peking Opera Blues). But I think there's a meaningful difference between that sort of thing and making a film that, to my eyes anyway, is a project explicitly in service to the CCP version of history. (Of course, directors just as talented as Tsui, like Xie Jin, made such films in earlier eras, but one could easily argue they didn't have as much choice.)

Tony Rayns has spoken about Tsui's roots in student activism, and his early films seemed to demonstrate a healthy suspicion of authority, but who knows, maybe he's become a true believer in Xi Jinping Thought.

[Mr Sausage]

Tsui has made Chinese nationalist propaganda films for decades, since at least the Once Upon a Time in China films.

Many Chinese films made in HK have a sort of generic nationalism, sometimes even alluding, usually metaphorically, to a hoped-for reunion between mainland China and HK and Taiwan (as in the ending of Peking Opera Blues). But I think there's a meaningful difference between that sort of thing and making a film that, to my eyes anyway, is a project explicitly in service to the CCP version of history. (Of course, directors just as talented as Tsui, like Xie Jin, made such films in earlier eras, but one could easily argue they didn't have as much choice.)

Tony Rayns has spoken about Tsui's roots in student activism, and his early films seemed to demonstrate a healthy suspicion of authority, but who knows, maybe he's become a true believer in Xi Jinping Thought.

There is a difference when we're talking outright state-funded propaganda, yeah. But I'd say the Once Upon a Time in China films, the second one especially, are more than generic nationalism. They spill over into outright propaganda. And I say this as someone who likes those films but loathes Battle at Lake Changjin. Things are never simple with Tsui. Getting a coherent politics out of his career is a fool's errand. His early films were full of satire, revolutionary zeal, and gadfly nihilism, but he quickly transitioned into films with more conventional social and political content that, at the same time, had comparatively progressive sexual and gender politics. Tsui in general poses a challenge to the conventions of auteurist criticism. But I think it's a mistake to think he's only now turned to Chinese nationalism.

I've long felt Tsui is something of an opportunist and careerist; and while he may've become a true believer, I think it's more likely he's just OK with cozying up to the regime if it allows him to secure funding to make what he wants to make. Sadly what he wants to make are long, sentimental blockbusters with a nationalist and xenophobic bent. But of the big HK directors from the golden period, he's the one who's had the most success post-handover, putting out a string of enormous hits. This is probably the most commercially successful he's ever been.

[Mr Sausage]

Where did you find out who directed what in Battle of Lake Changjin? The second part of the film definitely had more of Tsui's touch to it, even if it was just endless battle scenes.

Producer Yu Dong said it at the pre-release press conference. Chen Kaige was also present and said he only directed about five minutes of the film, mainly the ending. The movie itself actually credits Tsui as the sole director, even though the publicity materials still have Chen and Lam as co-directors.

So the other two directors mostly did the first film, with Tsui handling the majority of the second?

[The Fanciful Norwegian]

The first film seems to have been more of a true collaboration. Chen handled the scenes that take place in China (including those featuring Mao and other bigwigs), Lam did the more "brutal" scenes (the example specifically given was the U.S. fighter planes strafing the Chinese soldiers while they're playing dead), and Tsui was responsible for the more "emotional" battle scenes, as well as those focused on the UN forces.

[Mr Sausage]

Any idea why Tsui directed most of the second film himself?

[The Fanciful Norwegian]

Afraid not. From the sound of it there wasn't much for Chen to do in the second film, given that he didn't shoot any action scenes. As for Lam, maybe he had a scheduling conflict with his role as supervising producer on the latest season of the HK copaganda series ICAC Investigators, or maybe his services just weren't needed for part two—he was brought in on the first film at pretty much the last minute, suggesting a scramble to meet its release date. (Shooting was supposed to have started in early 2020 under Andrew Lau, but Covid meant that got pushed back and the production timeline was greatly accelerated; Lau ostensibly dropped out to do Chinese Doctors instead, but reportedly Wu Jing was reluctant to sign on with Lau as the sole director, believing it would be too much for him to handle.)

[dwk]

You have been asking for it, so here it is!
In the Line of Duty 1-4 Boxset including:
Royal Warriors
Yes, Madam!
ITLOD III
ITLOD IV

Pre-orders will go live shortly and full specs announced soon. But here is a peek at some of the art. Reverse sleeves, Booklet and poster art unveiled soon

Four classic police stories from the Golden Age of Hong Kong action, where the women kick ass as hard as any man. Michelle Yeoh and then Cynthia Kahn star as the toughest cops on the streets, using fists, feet and guns to take down triads, thieves and international criminals.
Easily the equal of any American action movies from the same era, the In the Line of Duty series are enduring proof of the genius – and recklessness – of Hong Kong filmmakers. 88 Films are proud to do their bit for law and order, with beautiful restorations of these four landmark movies.

US release.

[Orlac]

I had the HKL DVD ofpart 4 on DVD, but they took the 4 off the title! - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTVAXEhngr0

[Finch]

I was thinking of cancelling my Yes Madam pre-order with Eureka for some time now as I've loved the artwork on 88's Magnificent Warriors out in December and was expecting Yes Madam and the rest for the US, so this announcement seals it.

[Finch]

Question for fellow US residents: what is everyone else using for 88 US pre-orders? Amazon? Diabolik?

[therewillbeblus]

I typically use Amazon. I’ve used Diabolik before but my experience has been that it’s more expensive and delayed. Sometimes I’ll even use Rarewaves because the discs can be cheaper with shipping to the U.S.

So, unless Eureka randomly announces Magnificent Warriors as a UHD, it seems 88 is the best (or equal) label for a lot of these HK films, including Righting Wrongs vs VS?

[Finch]

Thanks, TWWB. Same experience with Amazon and Diabolik.

I think it's too soon to say if 88's will be better overall than Eureka's as the specs from either label haven't been released yet: it could be that the extras are the same if 88 and Eureka share the same contributors (especially if the materials were already put together before 88's ill-advised flirtation with Bey Logan). But I'm surprised that Eureka seem to be releasing those four films individually if the December slot for Yes, Madam is any indication. It's admittedly nice to have all four in a single box, and the artwork (presumably Kung Fu Bob's) is wonderful. I've never been a fan of Darren Wheeling's work for Eureka to be honest (though to be fair, the current Eureka cover of Yes Madam appears to be a cropping of a theatrical poster and his actual cover is still forthcoming?), so purely on that front I prefer the 88 release of Yes Madam by a country mile and Magnificent Warriors' cover is one of this year's favorites for me.

[therewillbeblus]

I’ve long since deprioritized stock in cover art, since I rarely take the opportunity to appreciate it (it’s just a spine on the shelf 99% of the time, and when it’s not I don’t typically pause to muse on the design before popping in the disc and planting myself back on the couch) and I doubt simultaneous releases will be all that different in PQ between two strong labels. I also don’t think a title like Magnificent Warriors is going to get a UHD! But I think when it comes between 88 vs other companies (Arrow, VS, Eureka) doling out competitive releases, it comes down to extras and if one is going to compete with one-upping via a UHD. I happily waited for the UHD-only option for Police Story 3, despite the terrible cover, from 88 films- since I had no interest in double dipping on the first two with the Criterion blu set looking just great already. It’s those subtle differences (like this box set vs individual releases, for those that want only the first two) that makes the decision making easier

[The Elegant Dandy Fop]

Question for fellow US residents: what is everyone else using for 88 US pre-orders? Amazon? Diabolik?

I typically use DiabolikDVD, which is my favorite physical media store. Like TWBB said, they do sometimes delay a little (something that began post-pandemic), but find their customer service great and they ensure you’re discs ship protected.

I occasionally order off OrbitDVD too. They similarly pack their stuff quite well and include stickers with their packages. They also typically ship your package out within a day and offer free shipping if you order three or more discs.