Technical Issues and Questions

[EddieLarkin]

The player can output 4K/HDR at 60fps, but it won't use this mode for 99% of UHDs, as they run at 24fps. Pick up a copy of Gemini Man and you'll find the player outputs at 4K/60p instead of 4K/24p.

[Peacock]

Exactly Eddie, it can output 60fps for 60fps disks but it can’t output 60hz.

[denti alligator]

OK, I’m still a bit confused, so bear with me. My player only has a choice between 24p, 60p (4:4:4) and 60p (4:2:0).
These indeed do appear on my projector as the refresh rate. Is this a terminology slip?

The trouble began with my HTPC, which I cannot get to output 4k @60hz with HDR (which my GPU is capable of). I can get 4K @60hz without HDR and 4K @30hz with HDR. In troubleshooting this I realized that my Panasonic is just as limited.

I realized it must be a cable issue (which are in the wall, so I can’t replace them). But does it really matter? Picture looks great. I’m not sure I see a difference between 30hz and 60hz on the HTPC (playing non-HDR material).

[Peacock]

Interesting. 4K HDR on a 30hz display/or mode, could only potentially create a juddering effect in slow motion scenes. That’s the best way of testing it. If it isn’t doing that for you then just carry on and don’t fix what ain’t broke.

[EddieLarkin]

Right yes, you must have High Speed HDMI cables which do not have enough bandwidth for such usage. You need Premium High Speed HDMI cables or Ultra High Speed HDMI cables.

But, as Peacock states, if your source is 24fps (basically all BDs and UHDs), you don't want to be using anything other than 4K/24p anyway. A typical UHD/4K/HDR adopter gets along fine with just High Speed HDMI cables.

[denti alligator]

Right yes, you must have High Speed HDMI cables which do not have enough bandwidth for such usage. You need Premium High Speed HDMI cables or Ultra High Speed HDMI cables.

But, as Peacock states, if your source is 24fps (basically all BDs and UHDs), you don't want to be using anything other than 4K/24p anyway. A typical UHD/4K/HDR adopter gets along fine with just High Speed HDMI cables.

So are you saying it doesn't really matter if I output at 24hz or 60hz (again, am I confusing framerate and hz?)? Because that would save me a huge headache. Actually, I've ordered a long cable capable of handling the bandwidth, so I'll be able to test for myself what difference it makes. I hope it's not noticeable, because I don't want to have to rip up the wall.

[EddieLarkin]

It does matter, you don't want to be outputting your discs at 30hz or 60hz. The discs are natively 24fps, so you want the playback to be 24fps. This is what you're getting by default, and that default will remain the same even if you change the cables.

[denti alligator]

I'm still confused about the difference between the refresh rate and the frame rate. My projector has a maximum refresh rate of 60hz. If my HTPC can only feed it 30hz (as it seems to be limited to) is this bad? And if the HTPC is limited (by the cables) to 30hz, then the Panasonic must also be limited in some way, no?

[EddieLarkin]

Can your projector display at a rate lower than 60hz? Some 60hz displays can use 24hz or 48hz to handle 24p content properly, whilst others can't. Those that are locked to 60hz are doomed to display film content with 3:2 pulldown.

We know your player is outputting at 24p, but what is your projector outputting when it receives a 24p signal?

[kekid]

Are any external Blu Ray drives available for Macbook Pro that are (or can be made) region-free?
If so, can anyone suggest a brand/model? Thanks.

[denti alligator]

Can your projector display at a rate lower than 60hz? Some 60hz displays can use 24hz or 48hz to handle 24p content properly, whilst others can't. Those that are locked to 60hz are doomed to display film content with 3:2 pulldown.

We know your player is outputting at 24p, but what is your projector outputting when it receives a 24p signal?

No idea, honestly. I need to test again. So, is framerate and refresh rate the same thing? Should I set my HTPC to output 24hz?

[EddieLarkin]

Framerate refers to how many individual frames your source content has per second. Refresh rate is simply how many times a second your TV displays an image. To have smooth playback of 24fps content, the display needs to be able to refresh at a multiple of 24. Plasmas would have a 72hz mode for this purpose and modern OLEDs and LCDs have 120hz.

I would imagine you'd want your HTPC at 24hz, yes.

[denti alligator]

When I select output to 60hz the image is significantly brighter. But I can’t get HDR unless I set it below 30hz. No movement issues, so I guess I should just be happy with what I have…

By the way, I tested and yes, the projector displays at 24hz when I set it that rate, and at 60hz when I set it at that rate.

[EddieLarkin]

Well, the display will produce better motion in 24hz than it would in 30hz or 60hz, so not having full bandwidth to achieve HDR in 60hz is a total non issue (unless you want to watch Gemini Man).

[denti alligator]

Cool. Thanks for your help!

[kekid]

I am looking for an external Blu Ray / DVD player for mac in USA that is either region-free or can be permanently set to region B. Any suggestions?

[senseabove]

I use it exclusively for ripping, not disc playback, but I got an ASUS BW-16D1HT and put it in an OWC Mercury Pro 5.25" Optical Drive External Enclosure and I've been happy with both. Ripping software doesn't bother with regions, though, so I can't help you there.

[M-A]

If you want to use it for 4K discs, you should get this one. For just bluray discs, I don't think it matters as much which one you get. Either way, you can use MakeMKV to decrypt the disc for direct playback from the disc by linking it to a media player software (VLC, MPV, MPC-HC etc)

[Guido]

Just got my 4K copy of Lost Highway, and while the transfer does look outstanding on my A80J, I noticed something curious: the ”black” bars above and below the image seem to have a slightly reddish/brown hue, which is most notable and slightly annoying in those extremely dark shots early in the film. TV image profile was set to Dolby Vision Dark.

Seems like with other scope UHDs, the pixels in those unused parts of the display are fully dimmed. Anyone notice something similar with certain discs?

[EddieLarkin]

Does the same happen in HDR10?

[Guido]

Oh, good question. I haven’t experimented with turning DV off on the player yet. That’ll be my next step. I watched the West Side Story UHD the other night in DV, but hadn’t noticed anything that seemed off (streams in DV seemed fine, too).

[therewillbeblus]

Does anyone have a recommendation for a cheap blu-ray player? I want to get one for my gf’s parents just so they can play the few movies I’ve bought for them, but they won’t be using it often/otherwise so I’m not looking to get the best quality for a device that’ll get action maybe twice a year (I’m struggling to find anything that isn’t twice what I paid last year for my mom’s in a similar circumstance, but I guess that’s inflation for ya)

[Drucker]

David Mackenzie has always recommended the basic Panasonic players as basically safe and no bad default settings that can't be turned off.

[therewillbeblus]

Thanks! Also, this sounds silly but I see "4K HDMI cables" advertised.. should I be using one of those vs a normal HDMI cable for my 4K player?

[fdm]

I still don't have a 4K tv, but everything else is 4K and so I still needed good HDMI cables so that everything else works well together, especially after the last firmware update my receiver had that updated some 4K feature in it (this was years ago). The ones I settled on and use everywhere are: Monoprice 4K Certified Premium High Speed HDMI Cable 3ft - 18Gbps Black. Should be good for any 4K situation, and they are inexpensive, and pretty darn durable. (Not sure BF15 code will apply, but wouldn't hurt to try, but perhaps they are BF priced already.)

I suggest the 6ft length as that's the optimum length for an HDMI cable, if I remember right. (Not mandatory)