evillights wrote:It's refreshing to see a micro-budget film enter The Criterion Collection, as it's one entry among the many that constitute what's exciting about American independent cinema for the first time in a long time.
Uh, would have preferred Primer - a film of genuine ideas - but maybe that guy didn't have famous parents? FUCK THAT GUY!
I haven't seen this film, but this thread seems now to be the equivalent of a 'pile-on' at this point. Are people now slighting the film itself for the camera it was shot on? That seems trite and petty. dSLR film-making is a perfectly respectable avenue to telling a story and has democratized film-making in ways not thought imaginable in the 20th century (or course, this doesn't mean quality film-making is universally produced). With this technology, film-making is really getting closer to simply being a matter of talent and I think that is something we can all applaud. Again, I am not saying this film is indicative of any of this, but it seems that it should at least be judged on its own merits.
Monte Hellman also shot Road to Nowhere with one of those little Canon cameras. The best thing about it, he said, was that he didn't need permits to shoot on the streets because it looks like a regular still-photo camera. People just thought Hellman and company were tourists. Of course, it helps that the crew was small, too.
Ishmael wrote:Monte Hellman also shot Road to Nowhere with one of those little Canon cameras. The best thing about it, he said, was that he didn't need permits to shoot on the streets because it looks like a regular still-photo camera. People just thought Hellman and company were tourists. Of course, it helps that the crew was small, too.
This is very true in NYC as well. It's a great way to get around permits and "tri-pod law".
aox wrote:I haven't seen this film, but this thread seems now to be the equivalent of a 'pile-on' at this point. Are people now slighting the film itself for the camera it was shot on? That seems trite and petty.
I was not slighting the camera at all. Merely pointing out, in answer to a question, that she used a 1080p device.
There are plenty of other, legitimate, reasons to disparage the film for those who wish to continue doing so. I thought it was lousy, but you should give it a shot. There are many smart people, like Craig, who enjoy it. It seems like many of those who enjoy Joe Swanberg and other "mumblecore" films appreciate it a lot more than I did.
Jeff wrote:There are plenty of other, legitimate, reasons to disparage the film for those who wish to continue doing so. I thought it was lousy, but you should give it a shot.
I actually can't wait to see it. Largely in part b/c of the strong reaction from here.
John Edmond wrote:Agreed. Dunham is just the film equivalent of Arcade Fire, Pomplamoose or Clap Your Hands Say Yeah. We live in an indie world, it's too exhausting to get het up about it.
Three very different bands, each with wildly divergent career arcs that demonstrate the term "indie" means even less now than it ever did (which, for the record, wasn't much to begin with).
I chose the three because they were divergent. My point was don't be surprised that indie people like indie stuff. Indie isn't a genre, it's a set of values. And trust me, all four scream indie values (hint: a belief in a particular relationship between humanising flaws and authenticity).
Had no idea that there were "indie values" or that that was one. I always thought that in the realms of film and music, "independent" referred to work created outside of traditional commercial distribution/studio channels.
I think that maybe I believe in a relationship between humanizing flaws and authenticity. Imagine, me, a middle-aged man who knows next to nothing about contemporary music and hates mumblecore films, and it turns out I'm "indie." Gobsmacked.
Jeff wrote:I think that maybe I believe in a relationship between humanizing flaws and authenticity. Imagine, me, a middle-aged man who knows next to nothing about contemporary music and hates mumblecore films, and it turns out I'm "indie." Gobsmacked.
See, this thread is finally helpful. Don't worry, I used the easily twistable weasel word "particular", so you're under no obligation to go out and watch mumblecore films.
In that Empire, the Art of Cartography attained such Perfection that the map of a single Province occupied the entirety of a City, and the map of the Empire, the entirety of a Province. In time, those Unconscionable Maps no longer satisfied, and the Cartographers Guilds struck a Map of the Empire whose size was that of the Empire, and which coincided point for point with it. The following Generations, who were not so fond of the Study of Cartography as their Forebears had been, saw that that vast Map was Useless...
A lot of ostensibly "indie" movies strike me as pandering to the vanity of people who fancy themselves outside the mainstream but haven't gone very far away from it, so that a film like can make superficial nods towards being truthful or uncompromising by like, putting a movie star in unflattering makeup.
onedimension wrote:A lot of ostensibly "indie" movies strike me as pandering to the vanity of people who fancy themselves outside the mainstream but haven't gone very far away from it, so that a film like can make superficial nods towards being truthful or uncompromising by like, putting a movie star in unflattering makeup.
But this isn't one of those films. A Blue Valentine or a Noah Baumbach film (whose films I like very much) are closer to that than this or Joe Swanberg or Andrew Bujalski.
Isn't this film legitimately independent as it featured (at the time) an unknown director with a cast of people who aren't particularly famous and financed by money outside of Hollywood? I think people here are getting confused with actual independent cinema and "indie" aesthetic (which, while having not seen it, seems to cater to those tastes).
So anyone know why Cold Weather and Daddy Longlegs were turned down in favor of this? Those films could've actually got an audience they deserved with a Criterion push.
matrixschmatrix wrote:oh my god that is the most irritating way to state an argument imaginable
hah, true, sorry. That's the result of a quick re-edit to make the original phrase seem less deliberately obnoxious, instead it turned it accidentally obnoxious.
I have one of those at home. Does that mean I can make my own "Tiny Furniture" and get it released by Criterion? Sweet.
In your dreams, Jody Lee Lipes is a master cinematographer.
Lena is a wonderful talent, I'm glad Gary and Criterion gave her some recognition. The filmmakers of her generation are really doing wonderful work, if you guys are able to put your fragile egos at ease, you'll see there are dozens of great films out there. Swanberg's work with Factory25 is already off to a great start.
What in the world does my aversion to a particular film or filmmaker have to do with my ego or its supposed fragility? I have absolutely no interest in making films, just watching good ones.
Jeff wrote:What in the world does my aversion to a particular film or filmmaker have to do with my ego or its supposed fragility? I have absolutely no interest in making films, just watching good ones.
That was more for the dude who thinks he could shoot this movie. The look of the movie is great, Jody made it look legit. He's a talent to watch. NY EXPORT OPUS JAZZ is one of the great photographic achievements of recent years. He transformed a performance piece into a film experience not entirely out of sync with Tsai Ming Liang. It has a wonderful sense of humor and sense of discovery.
bearcuborg wrote:a film experience not entirely out of sync with Tsai Ming Liang. It has a wonderful sense of humor and sense of discovery.
Oh boy, I'm not really a fan of Tsai Ming Liang, but this comparison is preposterous. Photography in Tiny Furniture was fine. Uninspired, but fine, it achieved its aim of polishing a turd.
Zot! wrote:Oh boy, I'm not really a fan of Tsai Ming Liang, but this comparison is preposterous. Photography in Tiny Furniture was fine. Uninspired, but fine, it achieved its aim of polishing a turd.
