Studio Canal / Kinowelt / Optimum

[Finch]

I like DVDOutsider but their paragraph on the image is plain bizarre: too much grain?! I can't for the life of me understand how they and Mike Sutton (who, oddly enough, did notice the heavy DNR on Arrow's Tenebrae disc) couldn't have noticed the DNR for what it is, and that it compromises the restoration to the point of cancelling out the transfer's superior contrast levels and colour reproduction over the DVDs (as well as better audio). Pro-Bassoonist, on the other hand, has, noting "a very thick layer of machine noise" in his responses on the DLN thread on Blu-Ray.com.

[David M.]

Actually, there is still a lot of grain in the transfer - it's just been chomped through. From the quick glance I had at the disc before returning it, it seemed that they've used a spatial (2D) filter that only affects single-frame data (a.k.a. "noise slicing). It still moves as it did before, only the 2D resolution has been affected.

This is a ridiculously ineffective process, especially for heavy grain reduction. The most effective grain/noise removal uses temporal filtering (and sometimes also light spatial filtering) to average the grain motion across frames.

You have to wonder what they were thinking.

[SternDiet]

they and Mike Sutton (who, oddly enough, did notice the heavy DNR on Arrow's Tenebrae disc)

He actually complained there was too much grain in Arrow's Tenebre.

[mfunk9786]

Ohhhhh when oh when will these weird DNR debates finally cease

[David M.]

they and Mike Sutton (who, oddly enough, did notice the heavy DNR on Arrow's Tenebrae disc)

He actually complained there was too much grain in Arrow's Tenebre.

Are we sure he's talking about grain and not that high-frequency noise? Very different things...

Ohhhhh when oh when will these weird DNR debates finally cease

Probably when the DNR does - things are already moving in that direction thankfully. It's no longer accepted practice to run noise reduction during telecine (because modern telecines don't produce noise, at least not when they're set up correctly).

Or if/when display accuracy becomes more widespread. A lot of the debate probably comes from out-of-spec displays...

[SternDiet]

they and Mike Sutton (who, oddly enough, did notice the heavy DNR on Arrow's Tenebrae disc)

He actually complained there was too much grain in Arrow's Tenebre.

Are we sure he's talking about grain and not that high-frequency noise? Very different things...

I'm not sure if they are very different things, to be honest. I haven't seen the Arrow Tenebre, but several other blu's that are supposed to have this 'high-frequency noise' look simply stunning and very natural on my display.

In any case, this Sutton guy did call it grain.

[David M.]

It's impossible to say without seeing the original source, but the noise is very coarse, with the image underneath not having anywhere near that level of sharpness. That alone suggests the noise is being picked up later. One explanation is the use of a CRT telecine with a poorly focused flying spot and potentially miscalibrated PECs (Photo Electric Cells). That theory would explain the soft-ish film image and coarse noise.

Of course, seeing as I don't have info on the source or processes used, it's all just speculation.

[broadwayrock]

Blu-ray.com review of Don't Look Now

It gets 2.5/5 for video quality.

[denti alligator]

This discussion is only confusing me, and I'm too lazy to pull up caps to compare (and shouldn't trust caps anyway), so can someone who's seen the Don't Look Now blu in motion say if the upgrade is worth it (I have the Optimum DVD)?

[JPJ]

Denti,watched Don't look now blu last week.Blu-ray.com is talking about machine noise but I thought it looked fine on my 40" Samsung.I would say it's definitely worth upgrading for the extras alone as it's very reasonable priced at the moment on Amazon.By the way,Peckinpah's Cross of iron seems to be another controversial release from Optimum.I'm surprised that no one(as far as I know)except dvdoutsider has mentioned the color changes made to the film.

[SternDiet]

Denti,watched Don't look now blu last week.Blu-ray.com is talking about machine noise but I thought it looked fine on my 40" Samsung.I would say it's definitely worth upgrading for the extras alone as it's very reasonable priced at the moment on Amazon.By the way,Peckinpah's Cross of iron seems to be another controversial release from Optimum.I'm surprised that no one(as far as I know)except dvdoutsider has mentioned the color changes made to the film.

I projected it on a 104" screen and also thought it looked impressive, the comments of blu-ray.com notwithstanding. In fact, I would say those shots on blu-ray.com bear absolutely no relation to what I saw on my screen. Definitely a major upgrade compared to the Paramount R1 DVD, which I've always found pretty weak.

[David M.]

In fact, I would say those shots on blu-ray.com bear absolutely no relation to what I saw on my screen.

Blu-ray.com's screen grabs are accurate (at least in terms of resolution; I've not checked colorimetry but I'd imagine that's fine too), so if the shots bear no relation to what you see, then either your computer monitor, projector, or both, are adding their own skew to the image.

Seating distance could perhaps help to hide the damage done by the 2D NR, though. Perception plays a big part...

[SternDiet]

In fact, I would say those shots on blu-ray.com bear absolutely no relation to what I saw on my screen.

Blu-ray.com's screen grabs are accurate (at least in terms of resolution; I've not checked colorimetry but I'd imagine that's fine too), so if the shots bear no relation to what you see, then either your computer monitor, projector, or both, are adding their own skew to the image.

Seating distance could perhaps help to hide the damage done by the 2D NR, though. Perception plays a big part...

Well, in my experience my Oppo 83 is quite sensational in the way it presents an image. For example, my Dutch DVD of Johnny Guitar was quite bad on my other players (color bleeding all over the place), but was quite good on the Oppo. By the same token, the machine noise that's supposed to be on the Don't Look Now disc was simply nowhere to be seen. So, the blu-ray.com screens may be accurate to what's on the disc (as say, 'raw data'), but it doesn't take into account how that disc is processed. So yes, both my projector and my blu-ray player added their own skew to the image, but I can't see how that's a bad thing, as what I see is almost always much better than some screenshots indicate.

[David M.]

DVD is a different issue. With DVD you have differences in deinterlacing, film cadence detection, and scaling algorithms which can change the look of the picture somewhat.

With a 1080p/24 BD going to a 1080p/24 display, it's a much simpler signal path. As for the Oppo BDP-83, I was a beta tester for that model and can confirm that it leaves what's on the disc alone (as a good BD player should). I'd have had things to say if it was meddling!

What projector are you using?

BTW, I didn't see any "machine noise" in the scan. I think that's just their term for film grain that's been spatially filtered and no longer looks natural.

[SternDiet]

With a 1080p/24 BD going to a 1080p/24 display, it's a much simpler signal path. As for the Oppo BDP-83, I was a beta tester for that model and can confirm that it leaves what's on the disc alone (as a good BD player should). I'd have had things to say if it was meddling!

Meddling sound a bit dramatic. I had an Momitsu before the Oppo and the differences are quite pronounced. With the Momitsu I did get more or less the same picture as on most screenshots, but with the Oppo this just isn't so. This is mostly evident in the way grain is displayed on the Oppo, because on the Oppo it's still very much there, but more or less a integral part of the image, while on the Momitsu it was more like a layer of grain on top of the image. So, all the discs that are supposed to have fake grain ('City of the Living Dead, Cat O'Nine Tails' etc.) in fact do look completely natural on the Oppo. Hell, even the much maligned 'The Stendhal Syndrome' looks perfectly natural on the Oppo, but not so on the Momitsu. There is a pronounced difference.

[David M.]

Well, I said the Oppo *doesn't* meddle. I've not seen the Momitsu - that's a shame if it doesn't reproduce what's on the disc properly. I know a lot of people were relying on those for region free BD playback.

[SternDiet]

Well, I said the Oppo *doesn't* meddle. I've not seen the Momitsu - that's a shame if it doesn't reproduce what's on the disc properly. I know a lot of people were relying on those for region free BD playback.

But the Oppo *does* 'meddle'. The Momitsu reproduces exactly what you see on screenshots but on the Oppo it often looks better. So, The Stendhal Syndrome on the Momitsu looks exactly as you see on those screens (which I admit is kind of weird), but on the Oppo it looks quite natural. I've tested them back to back.

[David M.]

As someone who helped with the player's development, I can assure you, the Oppo BDP-83 doesn't alter what's on the disc - unless you instruct it to with its various picture controls. Its Greyscale tracking, Gamma, colour, and resolution are totally untouched (OK, it upsamples 4:2:0 from the disc to 4:2:2 for transmission over HDMI, but so must all players).

Leaving the picture controls at 0 gives you unaltered video; something you can confirm with test patterns and in some cases, measuring equipment.

I don't doubt differences that you're seeing, but they're not the Oppo player's doing. Comparing to screen grabs also brings the accuracy of the grabs themselves, and of course of your computer's monitor and projector, into question. If these aren't calibrated then the discussion's pretty much moot.

What projector are you using? If it's not 1920x1080 resolution then the two players' scaling algorithms could be the cause for the differences.

[Finch]

Early word on Went the Day Well? is gratifyingly positive; relevant excerpts from the AVS forum review:

Picture:

Optimum present this release in its original 1.66:1 aspect, and they bring it to Blu-ray via AVC.

Digitally restored, Went the Day Well? looks quite splendid. Damage is light and easily overlooked. A few pops and speckles don't add up to much, but there are a couple of frame-jumps that are noticeable, albeit slight. The black and white imagery is often very clear and sharp. Grain is certainly retained and looks natural, so if DNR has been applied (and it surely must have been to some degree) it has been done respectfully and not robbed the film of its texture. Contrasts is fine, with only the minor fluctuations of age to detract from a very stable and visually interesting image. There is some day-for-night shooting, but also some very obvious nocturnal lensing as well, and all of this comes over well with pretty deep and reliable black levels. The night-time escape attempt from the church is conducted during a rainstorm. The glistening mud of the graveyard and the forked lightning that we see in the top left corner of the frame are quite brilliantly presented, as are the sudden screen-flares as lightning fills the shot and scorches the image a vivid bright white. Shadow definition is detailed and evocative. Nothing is crushed within the darker elements, which is definitely a bonus when it comes to the dramatic set-piece as George and the poacher escape and evade the Jerries in the rain-lashed woods during the night.
Close-ups are textured and revealing. Deeper shots of the village streets and the houses, or out across the fields and the grounds of the manor are also excellently rendered. Figures moving about on the skyline or creeping through the trees are clearly and smartly drawn within the frame. One or two shots seems a little softer than others but, on the whole, the image remains clean and vivid. The likes of the windmill and the manor house, or the gravestones and the church spire have no unsightly edge enhancement. And I didn't notice any aliasing or compression errors.
A very good transfer from Optimum that looks faithful and detailed.

Picture score : 7

Sound:

Went The Day Well? comes with a LPCM 2-channel mono audio track that is, quite frankly, stunning.

Given its age and limitations, this is rich and detailed and offers what much surely be the best presentation of the film's soundtrack yet. You can have lots of fun detecting the little Germanic traits in the English accents as the Nazis arrive in Bramley End, and also enjoy the switch from silver-spooned manners to strict, clipped and clichéd Nazi-speak. Naturally there is some of that age-related “containment” to the voices but, really speaking, there is little in the way of that usual “tinniness” to the dialogue. Listen out for the slight echo that we can hear from voices down in the crypt of the church, too. Nicely realised. Depth is above average, as are the dynamics of the track. There is plenty of shooting from a variety of weapons. Tommy-guns belch and roar. Lee Enfields bark and boom. Grenades have a realistically downplayed impact, without any of the sort of elaborate effects that subsequent war films would layer over the top to make them sound more exciting. The shattering of window-frames by gunfire is actually very crisp and clear and resounding. When Tom recoils from LT. Jung's pistol-shots, the splintering is very well rendered with some severe clout.
The rainstorm that the escapees use for cover comes across with definite presence. I was actually surprised at just how vital and realistic it sounded. The rainfall is fine and detailed, and the rumbling thunder has plenty of weight and movement within the mix. The screaming of the British troops when they finally come charging in does sound a little bit muted, but then the mix seems to deliberately lower effects that are happening in the wider open spaces, diffusing them with distance. With this in mind, I have to doff my cap once again to how much attention was being paid to the construction of the original sound design.
This is a great track that delivers more than you might expect, but it is in the subtleties that the real rewards are to be found.

Sound score : 7

[colinr0380]

And here's a DVD Outsider review of Went The Day Well?

[Dr Amicus]

Without wanting to start another aspect ratio discussion / argument / war, there is absolutely no way that 1.66:1 is the correct ratio for Went The Day Well.

The DVD Outsider review says it 4:3, which is what I'd expect.

Now that that's hopefully sorted, it does look rather promising...

[zedz]

Looks great, and it's such a fantastic film. Also very pleased to see another Cavalcanti film included as an extra.

[eerik]

Extras:

• Audio Commentary with Peter Bradshaw, Terence Davies & Matthew Guinness
• John Landis Introduction
• Dennis Price: Those British Faces
• BBC Radio 3 Essay
• Alternative American Ending
• Restoration Comparison
• Behind the Scenes
• Stills Gallery
• Excerpt from BECTU Interview with Douglas Slocombe
• Trailer

Kind Hearts and Coronets was scanned in 2K definition on a Northlight 2 Film Scanner from the original 35mm negative elements and restored in High Definition. The picture was restored using Film Master D.V.O restoration tools and PFClean software systems, removing dirt, scratches, warps, torn or replacing torn or missing frames and improving stability issues. The sound was also improved, with instances of pops, clicks, hiss and distortion minimised or removed.

[eerik]

Also, Optimum's 2012 theatrical slate includes Terrence Malick's new film.

[eerik]

Wave of Miramax Blu-rays is coming in September from Optimum:
The Aviator
City of God
Doubt
The English Patient
The Others
The Quiet American
The Talented Mr. Ripley
Gone Baby Gone
There Will Be Blood
Kill Bill vol. 1
Kill Bill vol. 2

Mostly just reissues of previous Disney releases.