1990s List Discussion and Suggestions (Lists Project Vol. 2)

[knives]

Yes.

[Murdoch]

No, since two of my favorite films came out this decade - Chungking and Crash - although two of my other favorites came out in the 80s - Three Crowns of the Sailor and Hail Mary - so to be honest it's a toss-up.

However, for me Wong is the director of the decade since I love every film he made in the 90s. Woody Allen remains elusive for me, the only film I've seen of his that i loved has been Vicky Cristina Barcelona while every single other film has left me very cold, I've seen about twenty of his films and after being disappointed almost always I've just given up on him.

However, once I am able to see more of his films, Ruiz will probably be my auteur of the past quarter-century.

[Gropius]

I am in two minds about submitting a list, because I haven't managed to see any of Hou's 90s films (no R2 releases, and I've avoided obtaining the ropey R1 ones), even though I'm pretty sure several of them would rank righly. Tsai will have to do instead. A Brighter Summer's Day will also be on there, although I'm not as over the moon about it as Zedz.

As a cinematic decade, I agree that the 90s is certainly weaker than the 60s and 70s, but probably on a par with the 80s. There are presumably many excellent unknown things between the cracks, though (obscure documentaries, undistributed experimental stuff, etc.).

Talking of obscure documentaries, I've seen that Drygas one, but am slightly sceptical about it, actually. Well-structured of course, but it seems part of that revisionist post-communist mythologising that took place across Eastern Europe in the 90s, seeking out martyrs to serve as a pre-history to 'liberation'.

[tojoed]

No Woody Allen, and certainly no Coens from me. Bertrand Blier and Robert Altman at the top -and neither of them will get on the final list, well maybe Vincent and Theo.

[zedz]

Oh well, I'd resigned myself to the 90s list being the most depressing one to compile (based on what came out last time), but Woody Allen and P.T. "Three Films" Anderson as the "auteurs of the decade"? You guys really need to get out more! Lots of great stuff was happening outside the USA.

The one-film-per-director challenge is an interesting one, but not one I'm personally applying for these lists, since, as some have noted, it would be rather distorting. At the moment I've got three Kiarostamis, three Yangs (maybe excessive, but, obvious flaws and all, even Mahjong has more going for it than most other films of its era) and four Denises (and now I'm wondering if I can really bear to let S'en fout la mort languish at number 53), plus several twofers (Assayas, Friedrich, Hou). But there's certainly the sense that if somebody's already on the list I'll tend to be less keen to include more of their work.

A while back I used the 'single example by a given creator' model to put together a '100 favourite songs' list (to be swapped with a similarly constrained maniac), which was a really interesting exercise. The rules were:
- last 50 years only
- no jazz or classical (since we both agreed that we mentally dealt with that stuff in a different way and their inclusion would seriously complicate the rankings)
- only one song eligible from any given artist (but different recording entities of the same individual were eligible - my shortlist included the Double Happys, Straitjacket Fits, Shayne Carter / Peter Jeffries, Dimmer and even Shaynie & Fifi '95, but I think only two of them ended up on the final list)
By limiting yourself to only your favourite song by a given band / artist you created a certain artificiality, but it made the task of compiling much easier and the final list more diverse.

[zedz]

An updated collation of the votes in so far (9 lists) reveals a top ten that looks a bit more like a criterionforum.org list, complete with two major surprises (for me, anyway) for the top two. One of these is the former number one, which I'd expected to drop off sharply, but no, it's hanging on in there. (It's a film I haven't seen but really should have).

Numbers 3 to 7 are all American. The remainder of the list is more than half Asian and more than one quarter Eastern European (but only just). Four period films, one fantasy. The longest film is four and a half times longer than the shortest one.

[ptatler]

Four period films, one fantasy.

Does my pick set during Gulf War I count as a "period piece?"

[domino harvey]

Does teasing Satantango, which despite my best efforts to snub it will undoubtedly place in the top ten, even count as a teaser?

[zedz]

No twice to those questions. I'd like to see Satantango finish in the top ten, but I'm nowhere near as confident as domino. How many people have actually seen it?

[Murdoch]

I was gonna get to it, but, you know, with the economy and everything... 8-[

[knives]

Netflix only sends one disc at a time so...
Considering Zedz said four and half and I can't imagine The Match Factory Girl not making the list, I bet he was alluding to A Brighter Summer Day.

[swo17]

No twice to those questions. I'd like to see Satantango finish in the top ten, but I'm nowhere near as confident as domino. How many people have actually seen it?

I actually managed to watch it twice. And I'd already seen it before...

[ptatler]

How many people have actually seen it?

I actually managed to get to this, a lousy torrent of the Yang, AND Van Gogh. That's something like 12 hours of my time selflessly devoted to this project just with those three films.

Am I to then believe that Black Ice hasn't yet placed in the final fifty? Cuz that would mean that Tarr's film would be somewhere around 217 times the shortest film on the list (and Yang's 118 times). Too bad. I was hoping some short form stuff would place.

[ptatler]

By the way, for those who haven't yet seen it for this project (or those who just love a great deal), Kiarostami's CLOSE UP is only $4.99 over at facetsdvd.com as their current "Super Deal." Not sure when the discount ends. That's as cheap as renting it.

[zedz]

How many people have actually seen it?

I actually managed to get to this, a lousy torrent of the Yang, AND Van Gogh. That's something like 12 hours of my time selflessly devoted to this project just with those three films.

Am I to then believe that Black Ice hasn't yet placed in the final fifty? Cuz that would mean that Tarr's film would be somewhere around 217 times the shortest film on the list (and Yang's 118 times). Too bad. I was hoping some short form stuff would place.

Sorry for the confusion - I was only talking about the provisional top ten. (I'm not sad and lonely enough to recompile the whole list every time another vote comes in). Black Ice has attracted multiple votes, though.

[Gregory]

By the way, for those who haven't yet seen it for this project (or those who just love a great deal), Kiarostami's CLOSE UP is only $4.99 over at facetsdvd.com as their current "Super Deal." Not sure when the discount ends. That's as cheap as renting it.

Shipping almost doubles it, but thanks for the tip.

[zedz]

Eleven lists in and we finally have a quorum (i.e. more than 100 films with multiple votes).

The new top ten is pretty similar to the old one, but there's one film that's been mentioned on more lists than any other (seven) that could well win in the long run. It's currently at number three, but at least it's readily available. The top three are all period films, plus there's another one at number six. I'm very surprised to see a documentary in at number ten (sort of): this may prove to be a dark horse, as it's featured on six lists so far, including a couple of top ten placings.

You've got just over a week to get your lists in.

[ptatler]

Shipping almost doubles it, but thanks for the tip.

That's weird. It showed up free shipping for packages sent to Tennessee. Still a bargain. I would have voted for this one but my specious one-film-per-auteur limit meant And Life Goes On won out.

Abbas was pretty much batting 1000 this decade. All of his films would end up on my list if I didn't stick to my stupid rule (except, probably, Taste of Cherry).

[swo17]

I move that ptatler be allowed to resubmit his list in the interest of abolishing his stupid rule.

[life_boy]

Seconded

...if only for more Kiarostami.

[zedz]

A dangerous thing to say here, but I've said it via PM to anybody who asked: I'll accept any rejigs of submitted lists received before the closing date.

[denti alligator]

Ok, I haven't had any time to watch anybody's faves or catch up on films I haven't seen and have been meaning to see, but I'm going to throw together a list of films tonight and my number one will be...

Institute Benjamenta, Or This Dream People Call Human Life
Vote for it!

[zedz]

Ok, I haven't had any time to watch anybody's faves or catch up on films I haven't seen and have been meaning to see, but I'm going to throw together a list of films tonight and my number one will be...

Institute Benjamenta, Or This Dream People Call Human Life
Vote for it!

(I knew you were going to say that.) It's still a voting virgin and I'm ashamed to say I didn't get around to rewatching it, but really should have. Anybody who's a fan of Careful! (which I also should have rewatched) should see these as a double feature (as I've always intended to do but never have), since they're both the mutant offspring of Robert Walser's Jakob von Gunten. Mea maxima culpa.

[Gropius]

Institute Benjamenta, Or This Dream People Call Human Life
Vote for it!

That'll definitely be on my list, if not quite so high up.

[ptatler]

A dangerous thing to say here, but I've said it via PM to anybody who asked: I'll accept any rejigs of submitted lists received before the closing date.

My list will stand. The only change would come from catching up with something new that I'd previously missed (aka A Filmed Miracle which is over there by the DVD player right now, daring me to watch it). If I changed my list today, then I'd end up changing it again tomorrow. There's a point where I have to get on with my life.

Institute Benjamenta, Or This Dream People Call Human Life
Vote for it!

I have a huge Quay disconnect. None of their films will end up on any list I make unless I have a sudden epiphany. Ditto Svankmejer. Now Maddin on the other hand... he'll make a showing or two on my '00s list.