Page 4 of 4

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2026 12:53 am
by John Cope
It would be difficult for me to launch a defense of the film without getting into more than many would probably be interested in, so I'll just go ahead and "spoiler" all of it:

Spoiler
The narrative takes the form of a cruise from Lisbon to Istanbul and the Gateway to the East; as such there is an implicit guided tour from Western civilization history and associations to Eastern. Longtime Oliveira muse Silveira plays (or "represents" would be more appropriate) a history professor conducting her young daughter on this tour, introducing to her in the most disassociated sort of way cultural landmarks and meanings. This takes up the first half almost exactly and the rest is a combination of this and even more explicit such musings around the captain's table, featuring Malkovich, Deneuve, Papas and Sandrelli. The Silveira character is obviously educated, a repository of historical facts and knowledge, but what is subtly emphasized is that this only constitutes a partial understanding; she understands but she doesn't (and this goes for the rest of the characters too, all civilized to a fault; it's what keeps them all blinkered to the larger, geopolitical reality around them). It's important I think that she's distinguished from just another tourist as someone who does have more knowledge and understanding than that so that this partiality, this insufficiency means more. Cultural myths are recognized, for instance, but really only at arms length and from a strictly analytical distance. There is something admirable in that but an incapability of comprehending how that is or may still be integrated in is the failure of it as an applied technique even, or perhaps especially, when that is self-implicating. We see this expressed throughout in a variety of quietly insinuating ways (e.g. "It's the Greeks who protect Greece", "Which Middle Ages are we in now?", the childless group at the captain's table, the fastidious way Malkovich removes his uniform at the end when it's already too late, etc.). It's the general tendency to view history as already over, already a museum piece.

What's curious about this or even slightly strange is just how self-implicating it is as a technique. Oliveira has always distinguished himself and his work exactly through the same sort of analytical, distanced precision, both formally and intellectually, as is under review here. So it is surprising really to see him be this scrupulous about it. But that is finally a testament I think to the extent of his irony. And it's never a simplistically either-or argument; his approach is less a polemical critique than a pointed observation.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2026 1:52 am
by denti alligator
Thanks, John. Interesting read of the second half. One that even might account for what I see as its weaknesses.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2026 3:45 pm
by Maltic
TBH, I struggle to come up with 10 titles for these years (which happen to be the first years for me as an adult)

1. Goodbye, Dragon Inn
2. PTU
3. Looney Tunes: Back in Action
4. Running on Karma
5. Master and Commander
6. Crimson Gold
7. Open Range
8. Something’s Gotta Give
9. The Return of Cagliostro
10. Come and Go

(not quite sure this was the order)

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2026 4:52 pm
by the preacher
denti alligator wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2026 7:14 pm Confused that anyone would put A Talking Picture at no. 1. Please reveal yourself and explain! (I don't dislike the film, but I find it hard to believe anyone could love all of it.)
That was me! :lol: Actually, I'm not a big fan of De Oliveira and it's very difficult for me to analyze favorably the film in purely cinematic terms (John Cope did a good work with that). It's Leonor Silveira's voice that really captivates me...
swo17 wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2026 6:45 pm Les Égarés [Strayed] (André Téchiné) 6
Bright Leaves (Ross McElwee) 4
Very good films. They deserve better.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2026 8:04 pm
by TMDaines
Not sure my ballot was included despite submitting before you posted the final list. I know I was quite late as I fell asleep and forgot the next morning after asking for a few inclusions.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2026 9:02 pm
by swo17
Sorry, it looks like you submitted just after I had downloaded the results to start tabulating. I've corrected the results post to add your list. Lichter is no longer an orphan

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2026 12:19 am
by andyli
Funny it still shows gif for Goodbye, Dragon Inn while Memories of Murder now takes the top spot. Sad PTU and Saddest Music are knocked out of the top 30 while Big Fish isn't :P

Jokes aside, great job as usual swo17! One tiny correction though: the original title for Café Lumière should be 珈琲時光 instead of 咖啡時光, a choice of kanji that reflects the Japanese origin.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2026 12:23 am
by denti alligator
The gif is from Dragon Inn, and is also in Goodbye, Dragon Inn, but there’s no way to tell that.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2026 4:10 am
by swo17
I couldn't find a gif for the Tsai film, opted for being cheeky. Legit didn't notice that the #1 spot had changed!
andyli wrote: Thu Jun 04, 2026 12:19 am the original title for Café Lumière should be 珈琲時光 instead of 咖啡時光, a choice of kanji that reflects the Japanese origin.
Wow, good eye! I could barely tell the difference but I've fixed it

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2026 7:03 am
by TMDaines
Thanks for updating. Sorry for the tardiness and inconvenience.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Sun Jun 14, 2026 1:52 am
by Lowry_Sam
denti alligator wrote: Mon Jun 01, 2026 7:14 pm Sad that no one else voted for the magnificent Story of the Weeping Camel
Oh no. This is my fault. IMDB must have it under a different year and when I went through swo's list I didn't see it or it would have been in my top 10. But it's not the only film I missed. In going over the results I see I also missed Blind Shaft which would have been in the top 20. Here's what I rushed off before going on vacation.

1 The Weather Underground
2 [Father and Son]
3 Monster
4 Capturing the Friedmans
5 Lost Boys of Sudan
6 [The Barbarian Invasions]
7 [Since Otar Left]
8 Destino
9 Harvie Krumpet
10 The Fog of War
11 [The Best of Youth]
12 [The Return]
13 [2LDK]
14 Good Bye, Lenin!
15 Bukowski: Born into This
16 [Gozu]
17 De grønne slagtere[The Green Butchers]
18 La finestra di fronte[Facing Windows]
19 [Kitchen Stories]
20 [Save the Green Planet!]
21 Thirteen
22 Kontroll[Control]
23 The Animation Show
24 [Beautiful Boxer]
25 Finding Nemo
Maltic wrote: Tue Jun 02, 2026 3:45 pm TBH, I struggle to come up with 10 titles for these years (which happen to be the first years for me as an adult)
I have the opposite problem, but that will change around 2010'.

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Sun Jun 14, 2026 2:33 am
by swo17
Lowry_Sam wrote: Sun Jun 14, 2026 1:52 am IMDB must have it under a different year and when I went through swo's list I didn't see it
We both have it as 2003 but for the original language title IMDb uses German while I used Mongolian. Maybe that's why you didn't see it?

Re: The 2003 Mini-List

Posted: Sun Jun 14, 2026 3:58 am
by Lowry_Sam
I usually sort my rated films by year and then pick out those I rated 8 & higher, but begin 2 yeasrs earlier because some films get sorted by first screening date rather than official release date..and work up to 2 years after. I then enter it into your database and if it doesn't show up, I go look at full entry to confirm the date. However very rarely IMDB doesn't include a film in the year group because it is using another date for some reason (& I haven't figured out why this is). For example, Errol Morris' Tabloid shows up in the 2025 films group despite having the correct date (2010) under its title, so it's easy to weed it out of 2025, but I'm likely to miss it for 2010. Because I was going away, I only went through your list once & skimmed very quickly, so it probably didn't stick out enough (multiple languaage titles probably got shorter shrift) to notice it (same for Blind Shaft).