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jbeall wrote:

domino harvey wrote:Kino's releasing another boxed set of Film Noirs on Tuesday, all five titles already available separately. It's up on DD if you search for "Kino Noir" as "Film Noir Vol 2" if you have the desire to pick it up before the sale ends.

Great find, domino. I think I'll pick this up.

So is this version of Scarlet Street an upgrade from Kino's earlier version?

I agree with Domino Harvey...I had no doubt whatsoever that it'll be the same disc aside from the case. Kino would have announced something had there been some substantial upgrade in this disc...assuming it can be made to look better.

Tribe

I've been revisiting Buster Keaton. While it's great that someone is putting his stuff out on DVD, the way Kino has put these together is kind of annoying. The shorts are tracked with the feature, and looking at the time is kind of misleading (I've been trying to do some shot-by-shot analyses and can't get accurate timing on this because of that). It's also a bit frustrating to have to go through three or four screens to get to the shorts. In the grand scheme of things, this isn't such a big deal, but I wish Kino had put the shorts on separate layers.

Grrr.

anyway.

Those Keatons are very old sets. I doubt they (or anyone) would encode films/extras that way anymore.

HerrSchreck wrote:Those Keatons are very old sets. I doubt they (or anyone) would encode films/extras that way anymore.

Is there any chance they'd rerelease them? Or are we stuck with the Keatons like this?

ogygia avenue wrote:

HerrSchreck wrote:Those Keatons are very old sets. I doubt they (or anyone) would encode films/extras that way anymore.

Is there any chance they'd rerelease them? Or are we stuck with the Keatons like this?

Many of the films (and all of the shorts) are available in vastly superior editions outside R1. MoC should be your first call for the shorts and the French or Australian editions of several key features are excellent. As far as I know, you'll still be stuck with Kino (or equivalent) for some of the features, however.

This thread may be helpful as an overview of how and where to get Keaton's films. The MoC release for the silent shorts and the mk2 release for the majority of the silent features (as far as I remember all the ones released by Kino in R1) would appear to be the best way to go.

Wow, apparently Patrice LeConte's MONSIEUR HIRE is coming on 11/20!

Caps just went up on the beev.

Tommaso wrote: One addition would be Shengelaya's "Melodies of the Verijsky Quarter", which I also haven't seen. But on one (or several) of the Ruscico discs that I have there is a trailer for it, and ever since I watched that trailer I wanted to see that film. Must be a very charming, poetic 'musical' I assume. Ruscico has it announced as forthcoming on their site for several years now, but nothing seems to happen. Does anyone have any news about it?

That title is slated for release in Russia this week according to the online retailer Ozon. Check out the Ruscico thread on this site for more details.

Guys, do not hold your breath in anticipation of the Melodies of the Vera Quarter - schrewd, but cold and calculated attempt to make another Oliver!, this time based in Georgia... One of the most un-Georgian of all Georgian movies!

videozor wrote:Guys, do not hold your breath in anticipation of the Melodies of the Vera Quarter - schrewd, but cold and calculated attempt to make another Oliver!, this time based in Georgia... One of the most un-Georgian of all Georgian movies!

Maybe "shrewd, but cold and calculated" is a little strong for what is basically a sweet but lightweight musical. But you're right, of all the Georgian films on the Ruscico release plan, it's hardly the most interesting. Give me Shengelaia's Pirosmani any day. I'm dying to see The Swimmer, but it looks as if they're putting out the censored version. (The central episode dealt with the Stalin era.)

So does anybody have anything to say about The Lottery Bride? It looks cute but I don't know too much about it.

I saw your post & tried but couldnt find a single review for it. I know Vintage Film Buff has it as a DVD-R which I was going to recommend as a cheaper alternative if its a blind buy.. but the fucking things about the same price as the Kino (I see the Kino running around 19 bux here in NYC stores, plus theyve got everything on sale, the whole cat right now).

I was actually thinking on splurging on the Fanny Brice musical (BE YOURSELF I think its called) that came out simulateneous with this and the sublime ALIBI (their "early sound" cycle from a couple months ago). I saw her clip on the ho hum "THE GREAT ZIEGFELD" and grew intrigued.

Yeah, I'd really like to support the release of these but if I get stuck with some blandish type early musical comedy that'd be bad for me. I picked up Alibi on Menzies' name alone, looking forward to that. I guess I should really just subscribe to Netflix and rent it.

To those who own The Movies Begins and Edison box-sets, which would you consider to be the more essential box-set to own?

RagingNoodles wrote:To those who own The Movies Begins and Edison box-sets, which would you consider to be the more essential box-set to own?

The Movies Begin - much wider range of work, including pioneering British and French titles.

I rec'd the new catalog Tribe was mentioning, and having gone thru it, here are some other announcements other than the Eisenstein, Houdini, and Pabst and Weine:

New Films: LADY CHATTERLY, IN BETWEEN DAYS, CROSSING THE LINE, CASTING ABOUT.

They've announced that they're getting a new edition of (take note Knappen) Bondarchuks WAR AND PEACE. Did you guys know that to this day this film remains the most expensive ever made, costing 100,000,000 in 1960's dollars).

New edition from a HD digital transfer of LITTLE FUGITIVE (the present edition will go oop in June 08), will include a new doc by Engel's daughter Mary about her pop. And like already mentioned the disc of LOVERS & LOLLIPOPS and WEDDINGS & BABIES... clearly inspired by (or in conjunction with) CC's RED BALLOON/WH. MANE (the same way they brought out the Deloin thrillers in conjunction w CC's LE SAMOURAI)

MichaelB wrote:

RagingNoodles wrote:To those who own The Movies Begins and Edison box-sets, which would you consider to be the more essential box-set to own?

The Movies Begin - much wider range of work, including pioneering British and French titles.

Agreed! The Edison boxset is wonderful, but the other is clearly more "essential."

I can't speak for ...BEGIN (I have one edition the one w GREAT TRAIN ROB which I picked up on a video store liquidation), but I can tell you that I truly believe the EDISON set to be one of the finest uses of the dvd medium to date. Obviously not as all-encompassing as the former, but as a study of the key "studio" (and man) that committed the primary experiments w technology... of which there were several concerning multiple inventions and innovations... camera, film, kinetoscope-to-projectors, sound-synch experiments... hand colorization.. tinting toning etc... which needed to be combined perfected in synch and mass... marketed w dependability... (notwithstanding the fact of the studio being a clearing house of some of the finest directorial/creative talent) the set is indispensable. You get an in-depth look at how market forces affected the business/legal side of things as things went along and competition developed, as well as the creative side of things. How issues of piracy were first handled (being battled to this day), as popular prints would be duped and exhibited without permission w huge profits; also how technological limits had to be expanded to correspond to demand... a film could be so popular that all negs including the original would be run into the ground via duping whereby films had to be reshot... and reshot... to satisfy growing national demand.

Whereas ...BEGIN is a study of the evolution of the films themselves, EDISON does the same, but gets you as well into the evolution of the business itself, showing you how exhibition bloomed along with the narratives, taking you inside THE key studio which brought the medium into existence by perfecting the technology... shows you the very first tests which have survived (also first sound tests), details the evolution from kinetoscope to screen with discussion between films from MoMA, Lib of Congress, and professorial experts on the mechanics, the various methods of projection, film sizes, studied means to stay competitve some of which were successful and some of which failed. In other words it's a full picture of the day to day, month to month, and year to year operation of the Edison studio from it's incep to it's final end w THE UNBELIEVER (w Stroeheim), with two ways to watch the film-- "the movies begin"-style, w just the films themselves, or with the films surrounded by documentary material corresponding to them. You really feel the industrial unfolding of the medium, how tastes prompted certain material to be lingered on, etc etc. It's truly fantastic and a real labor of love. I couldn't give anything that's out there a higher rating... and it's all lovingly presented like the most lavish CC (tons of extras like reams of exhibitor program catalogs reprinted page for page describing the films so they can choose, catalog listings for projectors, screens, etc) with a gloss bas-relief outer box, and a fold out 4-disc clear-plastic holder with vintage Edison ads for exhibitors printed beneath, total hoot... the kind of cinematic/market cojones that CC will never come within a thousand miles of.

All native, original transfers, no ghosting, conversion issues, meticulous gorgeous renditions of the best versions available on all these films (the GREAT TRAIN for example a MoMA original nitrate print with the original tinting, toning, and frame by frame hand-coloring intact!, also has the least damage I've seen of all the prints on this coolest of titles).

I was already getting ready to just get The Movies Begin and not think about the Edison set. But after reading that post by HerrSchreck, I am now going to make sure to cut other stuff I was planning to get and get both sets by Christmas time. HerrSchreck, what you wrote was the most convincing argument I've ever read for buying a DVD, it sounds like everyone should own it. I HAVE to own this DVD-set now, and thanks HerrSchreck for writing up that beautiful description of the Edison set.

Thanks also to everyone else who replied.

Yeah, Schreck almost convinced me too that I need that Edison set next to "The Movies Begin". There are a few Edison films on the "Movies" set as well, all pretty early ones, and I didn't particularly rave about them, but I'm very willing to be surprised....
The "Movies" set is wonderful, though. Almost all the films are in surprisingly good condition, and there are very instructive text commentaries on all the films. I'm constantly surprised how inventive these early filmmakers were, how much originality there was, probably arising from not yet really knowing how to handle the medium, and making up for this with sheer over-the-top experimentation. I think especially of the Melies films, but also of something like R.W. Paul's "The Motorist" with its famous car ride around the rings of Saturn. And that's just one example, the major part of the films on the set continues to amaze me for their charm and poetry. These films haven't aged a bit, quite unlike even the early Biograph shorts by Griffith, which show a very assured technique but are far less fun to watch.

Just wanted to point out that a lot of those (or all?) Edison movies are available online in high quality MPEG files as well: here is the chronological list I've been using (I haven't watched them all yet). Of course the DVD set is the one to get based on HerrSchreck's description, but at least the site is a good way to see what these films are like. Actually I didn't even know that there was a DVD set before reading about it here. I now know I should get it, so thanks.

stroszeck wrote:Wow, apparently Patrice LeConte's MONSIEUR HIRE is coming on 11/20!

Just watched this last night... really good film, and a nice release by Kino. Even some of their more contemporary releases aren't always from a great print, but this one does look and sound very good. As usual for Kino, it's light on the extras, but the film was so good that I'm pretty happy to own it.

SoyCuba wrote:Just wanted to point out that a lot of those (or all?) Edison movies are available online in high quality MPEG files as well: here is the chronological list I've been using (I haven't watched them all yet). Of course the DVD set is the one to get based on HerrSchreck's description, but at least the site is a good way to see what these films are like. Actually I didn't even know that there was a DVD set before reading about it here. I now know I should get it, so thanks.

Not even close. I just did a quick scan of latter section of the list, and watched the first part of The Great Train Robbery... which first of all is a terribly cropped, ragged 16mm print not only with no tints but with absolutely none of the toning and hand coloring the original prints had whatsoever. Every shot of any gun throughout the film (not just the famous shot of the bandit firing into the camera, which is unthinkable in b&w), the clothes of individuals, the blast of the dynamite that breaks the safe-- these were all hand painted corresponding colors in vintage prints, and for their set Kino transferred MoMA's sublime preservation original 35mm nitrate print, with all of these embellishments not only intact, but looking like the film was made just yesterday (Musser goes on at length how miraculous this print is; one of the crown jewels of the whole collection of the museums archives).

I didn't go down the list with any thoroughness, but one thing that jumped out which I specifically looked for was the absence of the feature-length The Unbeliever with Erich von Stroeheim... which is important in that it is the last film the Edison studios seem to have made, and also in that its the film Stroeheim took his wife to when they were dating to try and impress her (hilarious story told onscrreen in the set by Stroeheim biographer Richard Kosczarski-- or however you spell it-- about how, playing The Man You Loved To Hate/stereotypical WW1 Evil German Officer in this film, the audience hated his character so much they started cursing and throwing shit at the screen, whereby his not-yet-wife got so frightened they had to tiptoe out of the theater for fear of his being recognized and assaulted!).

Watching cruddy 16's of this stuff with no context is nowhere near the experience of the Edison set... which is far more loaded with films, films in far better condition sublimely transferred way out to the aparture marks (or "rounded corners" as they say on the beev), and loads of context and extras. By the time you're done you've achieved the equivalent of a couple completed college credits on the Edsion studios and by proxy the evolution of the medium in sum.

Just in case my enquiry slipped through the net over on the Silent film thread discussion of Epstein and Carax do you know if any of the Treasures/Edison et al sets have footage from a documentary I saw ages ago about the pre-fire Coney Island amusement park ?