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Here's Dave Kehr's review.

So, after I own the previously 4 disc of this collecion, Kino comes up with this:



(THIS SUCKS!)

edit: at least they're realising the new disc, The Doll (1919)/Ernst Lubitsch in Berlin, separtly.

Gigi M. wrote:So, after I own the previously 4 disc of this collecion, Kino comes up with this:

(THIS SUCKS!)

edit: at least they're realising the new disc, The Doll (1919)/Ernst Lubitsch in Berlin, separtly.

Eh, it's not terrible. At least you would still have the option to split the discs across two shelves. These discs were on my wishlist for my birthday and no one got them for me. I guess it was for the best. I'm especially excited about the doc.

But isn't Warner doing the exact same thing with their Val Lewton set?

Ah, DIE PUPPE at last. One of my most anticipated Lubitsch titles.

And again, you gotta give them credit for at least making it available seperately from the box. It's one of the things that drives me crazy w CC, and now Eclipse. This Kurosawa box has got my tighty whities bunched over the barebones releases of duplicate transfers of feature-rich MOC discs.

Falls too knees, Nova still on horse all confused, my loincloth getting wet in the pounding surf and wet sand..

"Damn it all to hell," pounding fist on shoreline.

EDIT: SO what happened to MADAME DUBARRY? aka PASSION? That was one of his grandest spectacles (tales of the near riot are legendary, with the swarms of tired hungry underpaid extras during a visit of Weimar officials-- there was nearly a real revolution on set mimicking the revolution being portrayed in the film, made during the incredible depression, where extras and labor was so cheap, these vast spectacles of Lubitsch, Lang, and Joe May were possible in Germany and no place else on earth), and has been needing a definitiive release for a very long time. Any of our German friends know if this has even been restored? Has Tommasso or Lubitsch seen any decent versions of this on German television over the past 3 years or so since the Lubitsch resto project was undertaken by FWMS?

I may be mistaken, isn't PASSION a Warner property?

HerrSchreck wrote: Has Tommasso or Lubitsch seen any decent versions of this on German television over the past 3 years or so since the Lubitsch resto project was undertaken by FWMS?

Very quick answer,as I'm about to leave for my usual Tuesday evening drinking bout in the Irish Pub in a few secs: No. Not in the last 3 years definitely, and I don't know whether they showed it before sometime.
"Die Puppe" is great, and so is the documentary (which is on the Transit box already, whereas "Die Puppe" isn't...argh...)
And I'm pretty sure that the rights for "Dubarry" lie with FWMS (why shouldn't they?)

HerrSchreck wrote:POTEMKIN in hand. More later, but up there w EDISON etc as one of Kino's finest releases. Very similar presentation as SPIRIT OF BEEHIVE... i e 2 disc fold out w booklet.

Image is a revelation.

It sure as shit is! I've never seen this looking this good, and that's aside from shots I'd never seen before. I saw this on TCM the other night and thought it looked great, but I had no idea how magnificent this would look until I got my greedy hands on it today. It's such a treat to finally see this in a decent print after all these years. Easily Kino's best release...if not the best American release of the year.

What a treat this is.

justeleblanc wrote:I may be mistaken, isn't PASSION a Warner property?

What makes you think it is, juste? Was there American seed money that went into the production or something that left US distrib rights laying around Goldwyn or Metro or something when Warner picked up all those properties?

Surely however, the domestic-- read German-- rights, regardless of what the US rights are, reside w FWMS.

You would know more than me on this, but I thought I remember seeing Passion listed along with Warner's silent Lubitsch titles. I probably should have stated it more as a question.

No I don't know anything about that (hence my asking). I know it was made in Germany during the height of Lubitsch's success / "grand spectacle" pics, I know a lot about its backstory from a couple of books on the subject, I have an interest in Lil Dagover's thighs after seeing them exposed in the holy sea and almost parted by quite a large snake in THE SPIDERS.. but I don't know anything about the financing of the pic or the distrib situation at present.

But again, if anyone knows what the situation for this film is right now, or if anyone has seen a cleaned up version better than the old vhs's from Grapevine, pls post.

Some of the clips excerpted (if I'm not misremembering.. maybe I should have dug out my old vhs to doubkecheck) on the Brownlow doc about German silents looked like there was a decent digitape already made. Certainly looked better than the old 1990's vhs's.

Passion was distributed in the US by First National Pictures, which was bought by Warners in 1928, so maybe they inherited the rights at that time. However as it was made in 1919 it's now PD in the US, so Warners don't hold the rights anymore if they ever did.

HerrSchreck wrote:Some of the clips excerpted (if I'm not misremembering.. maybe I should have dug out my old vhs to doubkecheck) on the Brownlow doc about German silents looked like there was a decent digitape already made. Certainly looked better than the old 1990's vhs's.

Don't pin me down on it, but I'm pretty sure there are clips from "Dubarry" on that "Lubitsch in Berlin" docu, and that they didn't look worse than anything else in the collection (if they're not on that doc, I've definitely seen them elsewhere). Same for "Carmen". So perhaps the only problem with these films is that FWMS/Transit haven't recorded a full score for them yet (only speculation), but the simple fact that Kino releases "Die Puppe" gives me hope that some of the others will come out, too. Transit might well consider doing a second set with another five or six films, though they are incredibly slow in releasing things generally. But the first box got a lot of raving reviews over here, so that may encourage them. No idea about the sales, though.

Given the wild popularity across the globe for authentic German Expressionism, I just don't understand the holdup on genuine articles like RASKOLNIKOV by Weine, DIE STRASSE by Grune, HINTERTREPPE by Jessner.. other things like Torgus.

I really wish another company besides Kino had a firm interest in these genuine articles. They try to round out their silent catalog with stuff from all over, and despite the emphasis on the Germans they still only pull a certain number of WARNING SHADOWS-type surprises out of their hat each year. I'm REALLY surprised tha EditionFilmmuseum is focusing on stuff like Stroeheim and Borzage (the latter HUGELY welcomed, make no mistake) when so much Jessner, Weine, Pick, earlier Pabst, Lamprecht, et al are sitting around. If we had one more Kino-type company getting this stuff out at a regular clip we'd really start getting a picture of what German cinema looked like in the early-to mid 20's... a wildly inventive and interesting period.

I'm crossing my fingers for the von Gerlach KRONIK von GREISHUS. Jeff at Flicker Alley mentioned to me he'd love to bring this out (its being restored by FWMS-- actually should be done by now, along with the full, uncut VARIETE' in 35mm). One of the finest labels out there for silents if not THE finest.. intertitles issues for the Germas notwithstanding.

Given the wild popularity across the globe for authentic German Expressionism, I just don't understand the holdup on genuine articles like RASKOLNIKOV by Weine, DIE STRASSE by Grune, HINTERTREPPE by Jessner.. other things like Torgus.

The issue with many of these, of course, is the raw material. I can't speak for Die Strasse or Hintertreppe, but, in the case of Torgus, for example, there's only one complete print in existence (the one at the Cinematheque Francaise). I was fortunate enough to see it in Paris last year and the restoration is stunning. However, since it's the only extant print anywhere, it will probably be a while before a DVD comes out, if it ever does. It's a shame, because it's a wonderful film.

HerrSchreck wrote:Given the wild popularity across the globe for authentic German Expressionism, I just don't understand the holdup on genuine articles like RASKOLNIKOV by Weine, DIE STRASSE by Grune, HINTERTREPPE by Jessner.. other things like Torgus.

Much as I'm with you in wanting to get these things out, I doubt the bit about the 'wild popularity'. Some people (me included) in this forum are raving about German Expressionism or silents in general, and so do our favourite dvd review sites. But as you yourself and others have repeatedly pointed out, it is very much a niche market which doesn't make much money and probably has to be cross-financed via other, more popular releases. It's no problem as long as the director is Murnau, Pabst or Lang. But who has ever heard about Grune or Jessner, let alone SEEN these films? I have to admit I haven't, but have the feeling it's not purely due to my ignorance. Which doesn't make it any better, of course.

HerrSchreck wrote:. They try to round out their silent catalog with stuff from all over, and despite the emphasis on the Germans they still only pull a certain number of WARNING SHADOWS-type surprises out of their hat each year.

And for "Schatten" they even had to commission their own music from Sosin, as apparently -as is often the case - FWMS did restore (or just made a new print of) the film, but didn't put a soundtrack on. These prints are then circulated through specialist cinemas and festivals in Germany for live performance with someone who plays the piano. That's probably why "Schatten" to my knowledge also hasn't been shown on TV. Same for Lubitsch's "Carmen" or Murnau's "Der brennende Acker".

HerrSchreck wrote: I'm REALLY surprised tha EditionFilmmuseum is focusing on stuff like Stroeheim and Borzage (the latter HUGELY welcomed, make no mistake) when so much Jessner, Weine, Pick, earlier Pabst, Lamprecht, et al are sitting around.

I guess that even Filmmuseum must make some money from time to time, and being able to put out "Blind Husbands" in a longer and better print than those hitherto known must have come as a heavenly blessing to them. I'm totally with you in wanting Wiene or more early Pabst from them. Why nobody cares to release "Freudlose Gasse", "Geheimnisse einer Seele" and the sublime "Abwege" (for which there even IS a full resto with soundtrack) is beyond me. But let's be fair to them: their list of forthcoming releases looks marvellous: Svend Gade's "Hamlet" (which you must watch immediately if you haven't seen it yet), Kornblum's "Wunder der Schöpfung" and these early Mack and Raffée films. Not strictly German Expressionism, of course, but still probably very interesting films which should broaden our perception of Weimar Cinema in any case. The only problem with Filmmuseum is that they are so slow in releasing these things, and that they've been held up the whole year over with these Kluge films (which are now out as a full collection from Zweitausendeins anyway, even before Filmmuseum managed to get their individual discs out completely).

HerrSchreck wrote:I'm crossing my fingers for the von Gerlach KRONIK von GREISHUS. Jeff at Flicker Alley mentioned to me he'd love to bring this out (its being restored by FWMS-- actually should be done by now, along with the full, uncut VARIETE' in 35mm). One of the finest labels out there for silents if not THE finest.. intertitles issues for the Germas notwithstanding.

That sounds good, though "Variete" is also listed as forthcoming from Filmmuseum.
EDIT: have just looked up the Filmmuseum site again, and "Variete" is gone That is, if it ever was there, but they definitely announced some Dupont in one of their early booklets, and I may have immediately guessed at "Variete", as "Piccadilly" is already out via arte edition. And what else could it be? But apparently, not coming to disc soon, at least not from Filmmuseum.

As to the old intertitle debate: it's nice to see that Kino seems to have changed their policy regarding this, at least with "Nosferatu" and "Potemkin". So I hope that Flicker Alley might do the same.

ptmd wrote:in the case of Torgus, for example, there's only one complete print in existence (the one at the Cinematheque Francaise). I was fortunate enough to see it in Paris last year and the restoration is stunning. However, since it's the only extant print anywhere, it will probably be a while before a DVD comes out, if it ever does.

I don't understand this, really. Noone in their right mind would show the original and only print in public. If it's restored, then it's a new print taken from that only extant source, and you can make as many copies of that new print as you want. And put it on disc, of course.

I don't understand this, really. Noone in their right mind would show the original and only print in public. If it's restored, then it's a new print taken from that only extant source, and you can make as many copies of that new print as you want. And put it on disc, of course.

Well, the Cinematheque is an archive and many archives occasionally hold public screenings of films for which there is only one complete print. If they didn't, nobody would ever see them. New prints could be struck, of course, but my point is that it is very expensive to do so and, given the relative obscurity of the film and all of the costs involved, I don't think it's going to happen any time soon.

Understood, but in your original post you said that the restoration was stunning. So either it was the original print unrestored, or they made a new restored print. As has been pointed out in many 'restoration demonstrations' on various discs, they NEVER work on the original print (in many cases this would simply be impossible due to the shape of the materials) but make a new one from it and THEN start their restoration work.

Surely Tom you must have understood that when I meant the wild popularity of German Expressionism, I meant in the world of silent film on dvd. Surely you don't think I meant the tweeners who are flooding Times Square to see LEGALLY BLONDE on Broadway are aching to see HOMONCULOUS on DVD.

I know that all of the films I mentioned have extant elements in 35mm, and I have vhs's of stuff like HINTERTREPPE and DIE STRASSE in wonderful 16's that look damn near pristine. And of course we all know RASKOL is setting around in very good condition, as is much of Lamprecht (EMIL UND, SLUMS OF..).

Take MICHAEL-- I'm not sure this film went thru a formal photochemical restoration beyond striking prints from preservation positives and running wetgate telecine to remove dust and scratches as much as possible. But the elements were in good enough shape to where rather than wait for a definitive restoration, the decision was made to create a master and make a disc.

This used to be done all the time, and we have many wonderful discs for it. Think May's INDIAN TOMB, JEANNE NEY, and on and on. If a restoration is pending on a title I can understand holding out. But if we have to wait for a full blown restoration for them to pull a transfer for each item of interest from the German silent era we'll all be dead before we get 1/4 of the way through the vaults.

And yes EditionFilmmuseum is a wonderful label, I'm simply expressing surprise that they seem to be skirting Expressionism almost completely. And again-- and I can't emphasize this enough-- by this I mean genuine authentic Expressionism, of the stripe that was pretty much dead by 1925.. of which we have perhaps three or four genuine examples on dvd.

It may be that Murnau/Transit has this stuff completely locked up viz rights, I don't know. My point is I'd really love to see at least one more label dedicated almost singlemindedly--like Kino-- to getting this material out there.. to fill in this blank in the historical annals of the cinema. It is so much abused, the label Expressionism, that a good string of editions could clarify the record for many.

Yes, it was clear that you didn't have the 'youngsters' in mind. My post in a way was inspired by someone saying- over in the MoC/CC Overlaps thread - that even among people who are film buffs there's little interest in silent films in general. I find that deplorable, of course, but think it's basically a correct statement. Just look at this forum: over 1000 members, but roughly speaking it's always the same 5 or 10 people you meet in the Silent Film on DVD thread. Even if these are all enthusiasts it might be an indication of the relative attention and marketability silents achieve. Among these few people German Expressionism, along with the Russians, certainly is a favourite topic, and of course everyone wants all these films you mention. I agree that it certainly isn't necessary to have all these films fully restored,which indeed would take ages. It seems, though - with the very laudable exception of Kino - that if any other company releases a silent film at all, they will go for things like 'brand-new resto with original music and 96 page book' or something along those lines, simply as a marketing tool to perhaps garner some little interest more than they would otherwise (Nick,should you read this: no slander intended, just a description! I'm more than grateful for the new Murnaus.). But obviously, you can do this with "Nosferatu", but it wouldn't be of much help with Robison or Lamprecht. All the more praise for Kino, then, but - as you say - they can't do it all on their own. Same for Flicker Alley, who also have a very limited release scale, sadly.

As to Filmmuseum: their release plan seems to be somewhat influenced (not to say hampered) by their 'cultural mission': a network of individual institutions all financed by state money releasing films which are 'artistically and historically important' (their mission statement). In Germany, this means invariably 'awareness of 20th century history', in other words: they tend to release things that are somewhat 'critical' or at least were on the 'good side' historically. Think of the Else Bergmann-Michel films (nice but not exactly exciting), the forthcoming portrait about Thomas Harlan (good guy son vs bad guy father, and a good docu that would have been an ideal extra for "Kolberg", which of course no-one DARES to tackle), or even Noa's "Nathan der Weise". I'm sure they decided to release this film (and not "Helena", which seems to be much more important) due to it being probably the first film having suffered from antisemitism and Nazism (way back in 1923 already). All this is very sad and certainly historically relevant, but it doesn't make the film any better. It's not so bad, though, but it drags enormously in its first half before it manages to get halfway impressive later, and it certainly is no match both visually or artistically for any film by Wiene.
So, in a way, Filmmuseum indeed fills in some blanks in our knowledge of film history, but probably not the most important ones. I don't know how this can be helped any time soon, and I don't see any label on the horizon who would do it, at least not in Germany. Arte stummfilmedition is great, but they go very much for international films (which is also great, considering discs like the Kozintsevs or Dulac). So I guess we have to wait for the lesser known expressionist films to be taken by Kino, hopefully. Transit seems to be out of the question. I'd be surprised if they came up with a second Lubitsch box before 2011.

I'd make a wager in one direction.. that if the FWMS didn't throw down dibs on so much of this material via the Uraguay Round Agreement, guys like David Shepard would be doing what they always did and pumping this stuff out at a regular clip with Image. The Stiftung did two things: pull together state and donor money together to finance some glorious restorations on sadly undermaintained masterpieces like the Murnau's and Langs and things like CALIGARI etc. But since their appearance it has become far less easy to get your hands on a print and push out a disc-- and more expensive, owing to rights aquisition, i e SHepards arrangement (thru Kino) for MICHAEL as well as the Filmmuseum's print for SEX IN CHAINS as well as the reconstrcution DIFFERENT FROM THE OTHERS by Oswald. This is the last time I believe David SHepard has touched a German silent film. I just don't think its as easy or profitable as it used to be for an independent producer like Shepard to create a master "on some rare old film laying around", and sign a deal for distribution of the disc thru Kino or Image, etc.

One film I'm dying to see is Oswalds OPIUM. Have you seen it Tom?

The windup of all of this is that, despite their hideousness, discs from Alpha become the default for eagerly desired titles-- at least to see them-- and, as mentioned on the Watching Films Online thread, viewing them on places like ubu or youtube. You occasionally get rarities like SHATTERED by Pick, ALRAUNE by Galeen, the full cut of VARIETE', etc.

And of course TCM... and-- shhhhhhhh...-- trading.

Does anyone notice any extra shots on Kino's Potemkin DVD that were not on the Image DVD? Other than the opening Trotsky quote, the rewritten intertitles, and the red-tinting of the Potemkin flag, I don't notice any shots that I haven't seen before.

The documentary on the Kino disc mentions that in the Odessa sequence, previously censored shots of the little boy getting trampled and his mother being shot were restored, but I already see those shots on the Image DVD.

You may have a point there, Schreck, regarding Shepard/FWMS. I don't quite know on which materials Shepard worked when he actually DID do German silents. Lang's "Spinnen", for instance, was found somewhere in the US or Canada, if I remember correctly,at least not in Germany. Shepard's "Michael" clearly also comes from a different print than the German version. So it may be that he worked on export prints or at least on materials not held by FWMS all the time, things not falling under the German or international legislation, at least at the time when he made these restos. That doesn't say anything against your point that it might be more difficult now to get these films out as FWMS are sitting on them.

And no, I haven't seen "Opium" nor Galeen's "Alraune", so I'm also quite happy about this post about on-line viewing of old films at youtube or others. At least for information's sake, though I hate to watch films on the computer, even if they are better than normal youtube quality. But I really avoid Alpha, even if they are dead cheap. Almost unwatchable is almost unwatchable, even if it's "The student of Prague".

kevyip1 wrote:The documentary on the Kino disc mentions that in the Odessa sequence, previously censored shots of the little boy getting trampled and his mother being shot were restored, but I already see those shots on the Image DVD.

If I remember correctly, they also say that the Shepard version (based on the last Russian resto before Transit came) already restored those missing shots. The main difference between Shepard and Transit/Kino is that the film runs at correct speed now for all its sequences (formerly the Russians had slowed down or speeded up some parts in order to fit them to the Shostakovitch music), and that the re-inserted shots are now back at the place where they originally belonged. So it's a matter of editing rather than actual 'new' footage.

I watched the documentary again, and it does mention a shot I hadn't seen on the Image DVD. It's the shot of the sailor lifting up the "daily bread" plate out of the water. So that's the confusing thing for me. They mention shots that were already included in previous restorations, and some truly new shot(s) that was/were included for the first time.

Btw, the Image DVD runs 75min but the Kino DVD runs 69min. The Kino disc doesn't look fast to me except in the shots of demonstrators getting angry in front of the dead sailor's tent, and their motions do look a little hectic to me.

kevyip1 wrote:Btw, the Image DVD runs 75min but the Kino DVD runs 69min. The Kino disc doesn't look fast to me except in the shots of demonstrators getting angry in front of the dead sailor's tent, and their motions do look a little hectic to me.

Apart from the possibilities of PAL vs NTSC (with the Kino being a direct HD-transfer from the PAL original from Transit, although now in NTSC, it has the same running time as the Transit-PAL) differences, the runtime differences may be due to the slowing down performed by the Russians on the version that Image used, and also to the different lengths of intertitles and credit titles. The hectic motions you mention might also well be intentional, made as a 'special effect' by deliberately undercranking the camera. Not unusual in films of the era. I noticed absolutely nothing that disturbed me.

HerrSchreck wrote:It maybe a typo but for some reason imdb has is as a 1 to 2.35 release (not that its' necessarily authoritative.. since its' fuckin imdb). Be interesting to see what pops here.

IMDb has incorrect technical specs all the time. They list Yukio Mishima's YUKOKU as being in color, for instance.

I've always seen Paradjanov's films projected at the Academy aspect ratio, and he certainly never shot anything in 'scope--unlike Tarkovsky. He did propose some 'scope films, though, so I don't think he was opposed to the widescreen format per se.

BTW: I alerted a couple of the staff members at Kino to make sure they receive the original Georgian language soundtrack for THE LEGEND OF SURAM FORTRESS from Ruscico. As some of you have already commented, the Russian voice-over translation on the earlier Ruscico release makes that DVD well-nigh unwatchable, even if the transfer looks nice.