criterionforum.org

I just want them to release

Spoiler

the tigers into Moe Dickstein's house.

jindianajonz wrote:

adavis53 wrote:if anything is lacking its Italian cinema, both in upgrades and releases. have we had any Fellini upgrades besides Amarcord and 8 1/2?

Latley Criterion has been doing great with Italian releases- They've announced Great Beauty, and we've recently had Investigation of a Citizen Above Suspician, the Rossellini/Bergman set, and La Notte. Though there was a period before that where we didn't have anything.

Oh absolutely agreed, and in my opinion last year's Trilogy of Life was the release of the year, but nevertheless Italy is still represented by less than 50 films in the collection, and while I may be heavily biased what with my love for Italian cinema I still think its pretty low.

and yeah, I'm all for more classical hollywood cinema if that's what you mean, Moe. I've adored their pre-code releases. I'm also all for more silent cinema in the collection, although this recent deal with the Harold Lloyd collection has been outstanding.

adavis53 wrote: and yeah, I'm all for more classical hollywood cinema if that's what you mean, Moe. I've adored their pre-code releases. I'm also all for more silent cinema in the collection, although this recent deal with the Harold Lloyd collection has been outstanding.

No, he means Tootsie, The Big Chill, and Silverado (OK, the last one is one I'm actually secretly hoping for, not Moe, but don't tell anyone.)

I also like Tootsie. Shhhhhhhh!

When it comes to classic Hollywood, Red River would be my most desired of the ones we know to be forthcoming.

adavis53 wrote:

jindianajonz wrote:

adavis53 wrote:if anything is lacking its Italian cinema, both in upgrades and releases. have we had any Fellini upgrades besides Amarcord and 8 1/2?

Latley Criterion has been doing great with Italian releases- They've announced Great Beauty, and we've recently had Investigation of a Citizen Above Suspician, the Rossellini/Bergman set, and La Notte. Though there was a period before that where we didn't have anything.

Oh absolutely agreed, and in my opinion last year's Trilogy of Life was the release of the year, but nevertheless Italy is still represented by less than 50 films in the collection, and while I may be heavily biased what with my love for Italian cinema I still think its pretty low.

Your argument that Italy is hard done by is not tenable in the slightest. According to the website figures, they've released 55 Italian films in the main line, which puts them way, way ahead of comparable filmmaking nations like Germany (19), the Soviet Union (10, including the post-Soviet states, from which they've released a grand total of no films), China (6, if you include Taiwan and Hong Kong, and their sole alleged mainland release is a ringer) or India (4).

zedz wrote:Your argument that Italy is hard done by is not tenable in the slightest. According to the website figures, they've released 55 Italian films in the main line, which puts them way, way ahead of comparable filmmaking nations like Germany (19), the Soviet Union (10, including the post-Soviet states, from which they've released a grand total of no films), China (6, if you include Taiwan and Hong Kong, and their sole alleged mainland release is a ringer) or India (4).

Agreed. I think Italian cinema is well represented, but I do think Fellini is under represented as far as upgrades go. Perhaps CC is waiting for his films to get major restoration work done, especially the 50s era.

I feel like that's getting a little nitpicky, and I'm not going to argue that there are other countries far less represented in the collection. Of course China, India, Mexico, and Iran are massively under-represented. My main point was that out of the five countries that form the vast majority of the collection, the US, UK, France, Japan, and Italy (with the almost purely Ingrid Bergman Sweden behind), Italy happens to be strangely low compared with the number of contributions the nation has made. But I also admitted my bias, I study Italian cinema and value it much more than other countries' simply because I spend more time with it. I'm also a big fan of German and Soviet cinema and find it disappointing that together they have fewer than 30 films, but again, my main point was responding to whoever had noted that French and Japanese cinema were well overdue for upgrades when together they form more than a third of Criterion.

I don't really care that much about The Big Chill, but Tootsie I am salivating over. I am interested in Hollywood films of yesteryear and all years. I'm a Criterion fan because of their work in Extra features and quality presentation, not the obscure cinema they were forced into when major studios stopped licensing titles during the DVD boom. Glad to see things returning to the good old days of King Kong and Citizen Kane type titles

Moe Dickstein wrote:I'm a Criterion fan because of their work in Extra features and quality presentation, not the obscure cinema they were forced into when major studios stopped licensing titles during the DVD boom. Glad to see things returning to the good old days of King Kong and Citizen Kane type titles

This will be my last post on the forum, because I just blew my brains out.

Ah yes, the bad old days when studios would put out mainstream titles in Criterion worthy packages that you could get for $15, and Criterion could put out absurdly lavish editions of things like Mr. Arkadin. Thank God that's all behind us now.

Moe Dickstein wrote:I don't really care that much about The Big Chill, but Tootsie I am salivating over. I am interested in Hollywood films of yesteryear and all years. I'm a Criterion fan because of their work in Extra features and quality presentation, not the obscure cinema they were forced into when major studios stopped licensing titles during the DVD boom. Glad to see things returning to the good old days of King Kong and Citizen Kane type titles

You don't honestly believe that do you? I mean it's in the mission statement, from the website:

"Since 1984, the Criterion Collection, a continuing series of important classic and contemporary films, has been dedicated to gathering the greatest films from around the world and publishing them in editions that offer the highest technical quality and award-winning, original supplements."

While there are huge holes, obviously, Rules of The Game, 8 1/2, Seven Samurai...those are among the films that help define the Criterion Collection to me and surely others. The thought that they'd have spent more time on The Big Chill or Tootsie and foregone Fellini, Kurosawa, Bergman, and so many others if only those dastardly studios had let them release them in the mid-2000s seems unlikely.

Perkins Cobb wrote:

Moe Dickstein wrote:I'm a Criterion fan because of their work in Extra features and quality presentation, not the obscure cinema they were forced into when major studios stopped licensing titles during the DVD boom. Glad to see things returning to the good old days of King Kong and Citizen Kane type titles

This will be my last post on the forum, because I just blew my brains out.

Always nice to accomplish one good thing a day!

Not everyone is a fan of every type of cinema. I also tend to lean more American/mainstream when it comes to my tastes, though I will explore other areas of film when I feel inwardly compelled to do so.

This forum leans heavily towards non-mainstream/non-American cinema on average, which is also fine. There's ample room for it all, IMO.

Also, by this forum's standards, Kurosawa, Fellini and Bergman are part of mainstream cinema. If that is the extent of someone's adventurism into non-American cinema they would surely be seen as swimming in the kiddy pool.

cdnchris wrote:I also like Tootsie. Shhhhhhhh!

Most people think Tootsie's a good movie, don't they? Maybe not on the level of Broadcast News, but certainly quite enjoyable.

I think somebody could make a killing if they stood outside this thread and sold pitchforks

zedz wrote: Your argument that Italy is hard done by is not tenable in the slightest. According to the website figures, they've released 55 Italian films in the main line, which puts them way, way ahead of comparable filmmaking nations like Germany (19), the Soviet Union (10, including the post-Soviet states, from which they've released a grand total of no films), China (6, if you include Taiwan and Hong Kong, and their sole alleged mainland release is a ringer) or India (4).

I may be in the minority, and I know other folks like Kino have released a TON of films that may eat up a good portion of available material, but it's always surprising to me Criterion has done so little with Russian, Soviet, and Post-Soviet films. Even beyond the ain't-ever-gonna-happen, long-rumored Eisenstein: The Silent Years box, there's so much out there...

I think an upgrade of the Eisenstein box they did release- or at least Ivan the Terrible- would be the single most exciting upgrade they could do at the moment, by my lights at least.

captveg wrote:Not everyone is a fan of every type of cinema. I also tend to lean more American/mainstream when it comes to my tastes, though I will explore other areas of film when I feel inwardly compelled to do so.

This forum leans heavily towards non-mainstream/non-American cinema on average, which is also fine. There's ample room for it all, IMO.

Also, by this forum's standards, Kurosawa, Fellini and Bergman are part of mainstream cinema. If that is the extent of someone's adventurism into non-American cinema they would surely be seen as swimming in the kiddy pool.

Well, they kind of are. Or at the very least if someone is going to be introduced to a nation's cinema those three are usual choices. You don't see the same level of excitement and talk for Naruse as Kurosawa for example and if you were to ask someone to name a Swedish director nine out of ten times it will be Bergman. Not a knock on them, but certainly in english territories those guys are mainstream to the rest of their country.

matrixschmatrix wrote:I think an upgrade of the Eisenstein box they did release- or at least Ivan the Terrible- would be the single most exciting upgrade they could do at the moment, by my lights at least.

Agreed. This, Andrei Rublev, or La Strada would probably be my most looked-for upgrades.

Remember that time I just typed "WHO CARES WHO CARES" over and over in frustration? Imagine it now in response to "(Enter national cinema of your choice) needs to be represented"-- how about "I hope Criterion releases interesting films, regardless of origin, in good transfers and worthwhile extras" instead? I know, good films are over-represented in the collection...

captveg wrote:Not everyone is a fan of every type of cinema. I also tend to lean more American/mainstream when it comes to my tastes, though I will explore other areas of film when I feel inwardly compelled to do so.

This forum leans heavily towards non-mainstream/non-American cinema on average, which is also fine. There's ample room for it all, IMO.

Yes, but the problem is that there are literally dozens of labels focussed on delivering high quality releases of mainstream American films, so wishing that one of the maimed handful of labels who deal with the rest of the world would turn its focus to the same small pampered playpen of Hollywood cinema is extremely insular.

The value Criterion can add to a Studio (or Olive, or Twilight Time) BluRay of something like Tootsie might be 10 or 15%, if you're lucky. The value they can add to an Eastern European masterpiece that nobody else will ever release is 100%. And that's leaving out of the equation the very strong possibility that the Hollywood title might be a mediocre, average, or slightly above average example of whatever it's supposed to be representing. I suppose you could argue that Tootsie is the best example of a mainstream eighties Hollywood comedy about cross-dressing, but there are so many qualifiers in there that you practically have to reduce it to a field of one in order to grant it pole position.

knives wrote:

captveg wrote:Not everyone is a fan of every type of cinema. I also tend to lean more American/mainstream when it comes to my tastes, though I will explore other areas of film when I feel inwardly compelled to do so.

This forum leans heavily towards non-mainstream/non-American cinema on average, which is also fine. There's ample room for it all, IMO.

Also, by this forum's standards, Kurosawa, Fellini and Bergman are part of mainstream cinema. If that is the extent of someone's adventurism into non-American cinema they would surely be seen as swimming in the kiddy pool.

Well, they kind of are. Or at the very least if someone is going to be introduced to a nation's cinema those three are usual choices. You don't see the same level of excitement and talk for Naruse as Kurosawa for example and if you were to ask someone to name a Swedish director nine out of ten times it will be Bergman. Not a knock on them, but certainly in english territories those guys are mainstream to the rest of their country.

My point exactly.

For me the fact that the Hungarian cinema from the socialist era is not represented in the collection is mind boggling.

Soon that qualifier will mean something as they have the rights to an early De Toth.

I like both classics and modern films! And I certainly wouldn't complain if Criterion licensed The World According To Garp from Warners! (hint, hint)