Lost Films

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The Elegant Dandy Fop
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 3:25 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Lost Films

#476 Post by The Elegant Dandy Fop » Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:19 pm

The flutter is absolutely the shutter of the projector. You could also mitigate it by shooting the image at a super high frame rate, but no matter what, the image is compromised to a degree through any method like this.

I'm sort of impressed that the person had connections to running a nitrate print. All the theaters here in Los Angeles have crazy fire prevention systems for nitrate and always require two projectionists to run.

Stefan Andersson
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:02 am

Re: Lost Films

#477 Post by Stefan Andersson » Sun Jul 04, 2021 3:15 pm

Plain and Fancy Girls (Leo McCarey, 1925), starring Charley Chase, re-found:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T051vZBPUY

See also: https://twitter.com/dave_kehr/status/13 ... 1274094592

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hearthesilence
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:22 am
Location: NYC

Re: Lost Films

#478 Post by hearthesilence » Sun Jul 04, 2021 3:47 pm

Stefan Andersson wrote:
Sun Jul 04, 2021 3:15 pm
Plain and Fancy Girls (Leo McCarey, 1925), starring Charley Chase, re-found:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T051vZBPUY

See also: https://twitter.com/dave_kehr/status/13 ... 1274094592
YES, I posted about this back in October! It's a really good one too.

Stefan Andersson
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:02 am

Re: Lost Films

#479 Post by Stefan Andersson » Wed Jul 07, 2021 1:22 pm

Stefan Andersson wrote:
Thu Jun 03, 2021 3:38 pm
Several reels of WB´s "The Gold Diggers" (1923) found in the UK. Info and link to YouTube upload:
https://www.nitrateville.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=31755

Note: YT upload features heavy image flutter. Upload seems to show a print being projected. A YT comment mentions an out-of-sync projector shutter.

Update -- relevant quote from the Nitrateville thread:
"the video I have uploaded was done by projecting the nitrate using my 1906 cinematograph onto a screen and positioning a camera to capture it, so apologies for the loss of quality. Similarly, there is a bit of shutter ghosting on some sections, which is due to the shutter on my projector. The jumpiness is also due to the nature of my machine's mechanism. To be clear, the film print itself is in near perfect condition, and any quality issues are on my end."
Update to the above post:
the opening section of WB´s "The Gold Diggers" (1923) has now been scanned and is up on YouTube. Relevant link and info here:
https://www.nitrateville.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=31891

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L.A.
Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 7:33 am
Location: Helsinki, Finland

Re: Lost Films

#480 Post by L.A. » Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:50 pm




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domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: Lost Films

#483 Post by domino harvey » Sun Oct 03, 2021 8:14 pm


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Never Cursed
Such is life on board the Redoutable
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:22 am

Re: Lost Films

#484 Post by Never Cursed » Tue Oct 19, 2021 1:20 pm

Dziga Vertov's second film, The History of the Civil War, has been either rediscovered or reconstructed and will screen at the International Documentary Film Festival Amsterdam

Monkey Ballz
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:14 pm

Re: Lost Films

#485 Post by Monkey Ballz » Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:04 pm

3.5 hr B&W "preferred" cut of Romero's Martin:

https://www.facebook.com/ronald.gorewoo ... 8504253697

Hope it can manage to be included on SS's upcoming set!

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dwk
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:10 pm

Re: Lost Films

#486 Post by dwk » Sat Oct 30, 2021 9:43 pm

They'd almost certainly have to significantly delay the release again and who knows how much longer they have on the license.

Monkey Ballz
Joined: Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:14 pm

Re: Lost Films

#487 Post by Monkey Ballz » Sun Oct 31, 2021 7:59 pm

There are suggestions at blu-ray.com that perhaps the extant delay was already for this very reason. Don't know if that's possible, as I'm not privy to any production or research timetables, etc.

Regardless, the newly discovered cut needs to see the light of day (pun intended... LIKE A STAKE THROUGH THE HEART) at some point.

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dwk
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 6:10 pm

Re: Lost Films

#488 Post by dwk » Sun Oct 31, 2021 8:53 pm

Doubt it, it sounds like it has yet to be scanned.

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DarkImbecile
Ask me about my visible cat breasts
Joined: Mon Dec 09, 2013 6:24 pm
Location: Albuquerque, NM

Re: Lost Films

#489 Post by DarkImbecile » Fri Feb 04, 2022 7:41 pm

This isn’t an exact fit for this thread, but I stumbled across a mention of MissingMovies.Org on Twitter, which I think is a new (or certainly new to me) effort to identify and work toward the reclamation and wider availability of smaller independent films with rights or materials issues, with the involvement of filmmakers like Mary Harron, Mira Nair, and Allison Anders
THE “MISSING MOVIES” MANIFESTO
Movie audiences are being told that streaming has made the entire history of cinema available for a simple subscription fee — or at least a couple of dozen subscription fees.

This is not true.

As an ad hoc group of film lovers and professionals, we have come together to create Missing Movies to empower filmmakers, distributors, archivists, and others to locate lost materials, clear rights, and advocate for policies and laws to make the full range of our cinema history available to all.

There is an immediate need to address this issue. The truth is that movies are simply not as available today as they were during the heyday of VHS when some brick-and-mortar video stores carried tens of thousands of titles. Now, with a few giant companies controlling the most popular streaming services and trying to outdo one another with original content, many older movies are being left behind.

Thousands of movies are either completely lost or are deemed too small to warrant the expense, and thus are completely unavailable. This is especially true of work created by women and people of color. As a result, we end up with a skewed history of filmmaking and crucial gaps in our cultural knowledge and legacy.

Missing Movies will work to demystify and help decipher the economic, legal, and practical hurdles that filmmakers face when they want to make their older works available. Those challenges include:

● researching contractual rights that may have been agreed to decades ago (sometimes with companies that no longer exist),

● deciphering underlying rights,

● locating master film materials (which may have originally been stored in labs that have gone out of business),

● creating high-def digital transfers.

In addition, all filmmakers need to make sure that their work is properly archived and preserved for the future.

Missing Movies’ long-term goal is to preserve a critical and beloved art form — one that is vitally important to the history of our time. To that end, we plan to advocate for revisions in copyright law and for changes in some industry standards for working with filmmakers.

We seek to formally create a non-profit organization that can facilitate and fund these efforts. To start, Missing Movies will focus on American independent films — including features, documentaries, shorts, and experimental films — but we hope to broaden our scope as work progresses.

Missing Movies looks forward to working with like-minded organizations, including specialty streamers, archives, festivals, distributors, film labs, trade unions, foundations, and a wide range of filmmakers, to find effective solutions to this critical, often-ignored problem.

The immediate goals of Missing Movies are to:

● Bring this issue to the attention of the public, filmmakers, and other stakeholders.

● Identify films that fall into this category.

● Create a guide to help filmmakers research individual films.

● Create a set of FAQs to respond to common problems.

● Collect case studies of films that have recently successfully dealt with these issues.

● Create a website to publish the above information and to interact with filmmakers, cinephiles and the press.

Working Group
Mary Harron
Shola Lynch
Nancy Savoca
Ira Deutchman
Richard Guay
Amy Heller
Dennis Doros
Sue Bodine

Advisory Group
Mira Nair
Maggie Renzi
Allison Anders
Maggie Greenwald
Dolly Hall
Allyson Nadia Field
Ruby Lerner
Tanya De Angelis
There’s also a link to add to their list of “missing” films on this page

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dekadetia
was Born Innocent
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:57 pm
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Re: Lost Films

#490 Post by dekadetia » Fri Feb 04, 2022 8:24 pm

While the stated intent is certainly laudable, "missing" feels like a misnomer — many of the movies on this list have at least received physical media releases, some even in HD. That said, it speaks to an unfortunate state of affairs that when your film isn't available to stream, it's now in real danger of being forgotten.

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furbicide
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2011 4:52 am

Re: Lost Films

#491 Post by furbicide » Sat Feb 05, 2022 4:15 am

Sounds like a great project, at least on face value — all strength to them, and I hope that they incorporate a focus on European and other international work in time, as God knows there's a lot of work out there (admittedly, much of it far more obscure than the titles on their initial list) crying out to be rescued and rediscovered.

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Yakushima
Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 1:42 am
Location: US

Re: Lost Films

#492 Post by Yakushima » Sat Feb 05, 2022 1:02 pm

This is a great initiative! I sent them a list of films by Kira Muratova. Her entire catalog is inexplicably "missing".

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soundchaser
Leave Her to Beaver
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:32 am

Re: Lost Films

#493 Post by soundchaser » Sat Feb 05, 2022 1:07 pm

It does feel strange to have Mississippi Masala, a film we've been assured multiple times is coming from Criterion, on the list - but if this squeaky wheel can somehow grease a release of The Heartbreak Kid, they can count Citizen Kane for all I care.

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furbicide
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2011 4:52 am

Re: Lost Films

#494 Post by furbicide » Sun Feb 06, 2022 10:59 pm

Yakushima wrote:
Sat Feb 05, 2022 1:02 pm
This is a great initiative! I sent them a list of films by Kira Muratova. Her entire catalog is inexplicably "missing".
Nice work – Asthenic Syndrome is crying out for an English-friendly release, to name just one. Let us know what they say! (I feel like Muratova is a good litmus test for exactly how far they're looking to cast their net.)

Calvin
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2011 11:12 am

Re: Lost Films

#495 Post by Calvin » Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:32 am

We could name any one of hundreds of non-English language films but, in reality, there are no 'issues' preventing their release other than a label needs to pony up the money and burden the financial risk of releasing them. Which is different from The Heartbreak Kid and, say, Robert Downey Sr.'s Pound which have willing parties but are for bureaucratic or legal reasons 'unreleasable'.

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domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: Lost Films

#496 Post by domino harvey » Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:55 am

Calvin wrote:
Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:32 am
We could name any one of hundreds of non-English language films but, in reality, there are no 'issues' preventing their release other than a label needs to pony up the money and burden the financial risk of releasing them. Which is different from The Heartbreak Kid and, say, Robert Downey Sr.'s Pound which have willing parties but are for bureaucratic or legal reasons 'unreleasable'.
The owners of the Heartbreak Kid are holding out for an amount equal to or surpassing what they received for the remake rights for the Ben Stiller version. No label has named the actual numbers but from context over the years it sure sounds like their asking price is in the millions, and thus faaaaaar beyond the means of any boutique label

pistolwink
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:07 am

Re: Lost Films

#497 Post by pistolwink » Thu Feb 10, 2022 5:02 pm

Calvin wrote:
Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:32 am
We could name any one of hundreds of non-English language films but, in reality, there are no 'issues' preventing their release other than a label needs to pony up the money and burden the financial risk of releasing them. Which is different from The Heartbreak Kid and, say, Robert Downey Sr.'s Pound which have willing parties but are for bureaucratic or legal reasons 'unreleasable'.
Yeah, the "problem" in most cases is just ... capitalism.

Stefan Andersson
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:02 am

Re: Lost Films

#498 Post by Stefan Andersson » Tue Apr 05, 2022 1:19 pm

"The Net" (1916), a Thanhouser production, has been rediscovered in the National Library of Norway archives. Now available on DVD or streaming. More info here:

https://www.nitrateville.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=32954


https://www.thanhouser.org/films/The_Net_DVD.htm

https://www.thanhouser.org/

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L.A.
Joined: Thu May 28, 2009 7:33 am
Location: Helsinki, Finland

Re: Lost Films

#499 Post by L.A. » Sun May 15, 2022 6:09 am

BBC’s article how archivists are trying to locate Alam Ara (1931), the first talkie made in India.

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MichaelB
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:20 pm
Location: Worthing
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Re: Lost Films

#500 Post by MichaelB » Sun May 15, 2022 7:37 am

pistolwink wrote:
Thu Feb 10, 2022 5:02 pm
Yeah, the "problem" in most cases is just ... capitalism.
The full two-and-a-half hour version of India's first Technicolor film Jhansi Ki Rani (1952) still survives, but only as separation elements archived by the BFI; I don't believe it's been publicly viewable for decades except in drastically cut versions with terrible colour.

Since the separation elements still survive and are being properly preserved, a glorious-looking full-scale restoration is at least notionally possible - but it's going to cost a minimum of six figures and possibly more, so realistically it'll need funding by a major cultural institution (or actual cultural ministry) rather than a video label. But I know for a fact that the only obstacle is to do with the physical cost of restoration: the filmmaker's son couldn't be keener on the prospect of getting it restored, and he's certainly not personally in it for the money.

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