Carlotta: Coffrets Kenji Mizoguchi

Discuss internationally-released DVDs and Blu-rays or other international DVD and Blu-ray-related topics.
Message
Author
peerpee
not perpee
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:41 pm

#51 Post by peerpee » Sun May 07, 2006 9:45 am

I don't have any figures for any other companies' sales, no. It's not the sort of thing that companies like to discuss on public fora.

User avatar
kinjitsu
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:39 pm
Location: Uffa!

#52 Post by kinjitsu » Fri May 18, 2007 7:52 pm

Tim wrote:Has anybody noticed this forthcoming collection of Mizoguchi films from the forties?
Michael Kerpan wrote:This seems to be a French port of the films released in Japan by Shochiku.

I think "Five Women Around Utamaro" and "Love of Sumako the Actress" are really excellent. I found "Women of the Night" and "My Love is Burning" pretty disappointing overall (though not lacking in interest). "Famed Sword Bijomaru" is surprisingly bad -- given the good cast it had. "Miyamoto Musashi" would have been a far better pick for the set.
Tommaso wrote:Damn brilliant news! I assume, though, that there will again be only French subs...
davidhare wrote:A friend has just pointed this out, otherwise I would have missed it.

These titles virtually round out the complete post war Mizo, when added to the earlier two volumes from GCTHV (and the forthcoming MoCs?) Not forgetting of course the two Tartan titles from a couple of years ago, Life of Oharu and Lady Musashino (Michael I revise my opinion to nominate this as Mizo's worst post-war movie.)
Last edited by kinjitsu on Fri May 18, 2007 8:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Awesome Welles
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2007 6:02 am
Location: London

#53 Post by Awesome Welles » Mon May 28, 2007 6:44 pm

A boxset from France which will be released by Gaumont Columbia on 20th June at 50 euros and contains the films:

The Famous Sword Bijomaru
Five Women Around Utamaro
The Love of Sumako the Actress
Women of the Night
Flame of My Love


Looks like a very interesting selection, I'm not sure of the quality but I'm sure someone can fill us in. Does anyone else have any more information on this set? As far as I can see no English subs the amazon page here does not say, but this page indicates only French (removable) subs, unfortunately. Shame as it looks like a nice set, those French speakers around the world, however, may be interested.

ptmd
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:12 pm

#54 Post by ptmd » Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:16 pm

davidhare wrote:Here are some caps from 5 Women Around Utamaro from the new French Carlotta Coffret of Mizo Annees 40s
I think that, in the case of Utamaro at least, there must be something wrong with the source materials. I've seen three separate 35mm prints of this, one from Janus, one at the Museum of Modern Art, and one at the National Film Center in Tokyo, and they all looked more or less like the image in the screen capture. I doubt it will ever look much better than on the Carlotta DVD (the Raro DVD is considerably worse).

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#55 Post by Michael Kerpan » Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:22 pm

I'm afraid that for almost all of the surviving early Mizoguchi films, the source materials are pretty dire.

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#56 Post by Michael Kerpan » Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:17 am

Well -- Musashi Miyamoto is an absolutely exquisite little film -- and about 1000% more impressive (as a whole) than "Bijomaru". One of Mizoguchi's best "unknown films".

I doubt we will ever agree on the merits (or demerits) of Utamaro. ;~{

I think Sumako and Madame Yuki are also wonderful films from this period. And Women of the Night has a lot of material that LOOKS great -- even if the story is poorly conceived and presented.

I greatly fear that the prints that were used for the ancient SBS broadcasts have deteriorated irreparably since then.

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#57 Post by Michael Kerpan » Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:59 am

I'm surprised over your enthusiasm for "Bijomaru" -- as I consider it quite inferior to "Genroku chushingura" and ""Musashi Miyamoto".

"Sumako" shows Tanaka at pretty much the top of her form (at least in Mizoguchi)..

Isn't frame jitter due mostly to film shrinkage? If so, the primary source elements could really have degraded a lot in the past few decades. Short of a M-style restoration effort (something Japanese studios won't pay for), is there anything one can do about this?

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#58 Post by Michael Kerpan » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:19 pm

davidhare wrote:I have absolutely no explanation for the parlous state of Japanese film preservation.
Except, perhaps, for Toho -- it is not clear that Japanese studios knew or cared much about film preservation until fairly recently. Somehow, the film technology orientation of PCL must have had some continuing influence even after they were merged into Toho. The fact that Toho preserved every single film Naruse made for PCL and Toho, many in reasonably good condition (over the course of over 30 years) is astonishing. Especially when one considers that important films made by Ozu and Mizoguchi during this period are lost or incredibly deteriorated.

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#59 Post by Michael Kerpan » Wed Jul 25, 2007 8:53 am

I prefer to enjoy Mizoguchi films rather than worship them. I don't even worship Ozu (or Naruse) films. ;~}

I would NEVER describe the mis-en-scene in this film as "impoverished" -- the only late 40s Mizoguchi film I might describe in that way is "Victory of Women".

User avatar
Don Lope de Aguirre
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2006 5:39 pm
Location: London

#60 Post by Don Lope de Aguirre » Fri Aug 31, 2007 4:39 pm

From MK2 in October: Kenji Mizoguchi : Les 47 ronins - Contes des chrysanthemes tardifs - L'Elegie de Naniwa (Coffret de 4 DVD)

Ronin has supposedly been 'restored', so this is good news, at least not only for those who speak French

Jeff LeVine
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles
Contact:

#61 Post by Jeff LeVine » Thu Oct 18, 2007 1:22 pm

You know - I was looking at that last night... I think it's just amazon.fr (which is often messed up). It says "in stock" on the mk2 site. I'm pretty sure it will be showing up in the online stores shortly (fnac has it listed for tomorrow, for example).

Oop - here's a test of the set...

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#62 Post by Michael Kerpan » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:42 pm

Rewatched three of these 40s films: comments and pictures.

I gave Bijomaru another shot -- and still consider the worst of all the 30 or so Mizoguchi films I've seen (in almost every respect).

Murasaki53
Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2006 2:54 am

#63 Post by Murasaki53 » Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:41 am

Finally got around to watching Lady of Musashino yesterday and actually found it to be a lot better than I expected. The anti-war sentiments expressed in the opening minutes came as something of a surprise. I've been used to seeing these conveyed in a more indirect manner in most of the Japanese films I've watched so far. The allusions to sex were a surprise too. Would this film have been a bit risque for 1951 by Japanese standards? And the opening shots of the skies above Musashino were terrific.

Thought the script was quite thoughtful and engaging too though the story didn't quite sustain itself over the full 85 minutes (and it was never going to anyway as the disc froze just before the end as noted in the DVD Beaver review). I might now seek out Shohei Ooka's novel as his 'Fires On The Plain' was extraordinary.

All in all, this was definitely worth seeing. Though I'd swap it right away for a decent version of 47 Ronin with English subs.

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#64 Post by Michael Kerpan » Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:57 am

Murasaki53 wrote:Finally got around to watching Lady of Musashino yesterday and actually found it to be a lot better than I expected. The anti-war sentiments expressed in the opening minutes came as something of a surprise. I've been used to seeing these conveyed in a more indirect manner in most of the Japanese films I've watched so far. The allusions to sex were a surprise too. Would this film have been a bit risque for 1951 by Japanese standards? And the opening shots of the skies above Musashino were terrific.
Anti-war sentiments were practically mandatory in the Occupation era (due to the demands of US censors).

Lots of risque stuff (though mild compared to later films) started cropping up after the war. "Bad girl" films were quite popular then.

Many good things about the film (esp. the cinematography) -- but I differ on your assessment of the script -- which I found pretty ineffective (and unbelievable).

Murasaki53
Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2006 2:54 am

#65 Post by Murasaki53 » Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:31 pm

Michael, that's interesting background information. But what was it that you found unbelievable? Was it all the extra-marital shenanigans?

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#66 Post by Michael Kerpan » Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:05 pm

Murasaki53 wrote:Michael, that's interesting background information. But what was it that you found unbelievable? Was it all the extra-marital shenanigans?
What was unbelievable is HOW the events played out. Much more like a over-the-top, melodramatic shimpa play of the 20s than anything like real life in the post-war era.

And then there was the almost comically abrupt way the old folk were polished off.

User avatar
the dancing kid
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 7:35 pm

#67 Post by the dancing kid » Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:23 pm

Michael Kerpan wrote:Anti-war sentiments were practically mandatory in the Occupation era (due to the demands of US censors).
I'm not sure I agree. American censors were uncomfortable with almost any reference to the war, even anti-war sentiments. There were indirect visual representations of the war, such as graveyards, but you didn't see a lot of explicitly anti-war content until after the Occupation. The most visible agenda being pushed by the Occupying forces was a focus on liberalism and heterosexuality.

However, in my opinion most of the anti-war content in the later post-war films is more useful at indexing the cognitive dissonance of Japan's political culture than it is in showing how successful the Occupation project had been. Mitsuhiro Yoshimoto's essay on post-war melodrama made in Japan does a great job of articulating the "victim consciousness" of these films.
Lots of risque stuff (though mild compared to later films) started cropping up after the war. "Bad girl" films were quite popular then.
While it's true that there was more sexually themed content in Japanese films than American films, I'm not sure if I would categorize them as risque. Films like Teenage Sex Manual were basically after school special style films that tried to portray the "dangers of youth" and such. The girls in these films weren't usually bad, but rather misled and abused by their boyfriends and other men.

Women and women's bodies were definitely one of the main battlefields of post-war Japanese social life, but women didn't become real agents in film until the fifties as far as I can tell. The social and political of emasculation of men was present in films almost immediately after the way, since the trauma of the war was placed completely on the shoulders of men

iangj
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 1:52 pm
Location: Taipei, Taiwan

Re: Mizoguchi les ans 30s (Carlotta France)

#68 Post by iangj » Sun Mar 16, 2008 7:22 am

davidhare wrote:Apart from Oyuki the Virgin I cannot identify the other two titles from this coffret

Perhpas Michael could oblige before I run amok and order it.
La cicogne en papier [aka O'sen aux cigognes de papier] = The Downfall of Osen 1935

Les coquelicots = Poppy 1935

Maybe Carlotta should have called this Mizoguchi 1935...

User avatar
sidehacker
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:49 am
Location: Bowling Green, Ohio
Contact:

#69 Post by sidehacker » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:18 am

Off-topic, but sort of not: has anyone seen the French disc of Sisters of the Gion mentioned towards the bottom of the page?

User avatar
sidehacker
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:49 am
Location: Bowling Green, Ohio
Contact:

#70 Post by sidehacker » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:10 am

Completely off-topic, looks like Carlotta is putting out a Yoshishige Yoshida boxset as well.

User avatar
Ornette
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 10:41 am

#71 Post by Ornette » Fri Mar 21, 2008 2:22 pm

David, you can find a review of T-Men and on the Beaver and here's a review comparing the Sony and VCI editions of Raw Deal (no idea about the Wildside edition, but I've a feeling it ain't much of an improvement -- would love to be proven wrong though).

I'm beginning to think, fuck my lousy French skills, I'm going to buy these boxes anyway. It's like torture waiting for these to be released with English subs. I just bit the bullet for Remorques and Gueule d'amour, so it's not that far off.

And David, be sure to post some screengrabs from the Mizo coffret!

User avatar
Michael Kerpan
Spelling Bee Champeen
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
Location: New England
Contact:

#72 Post by Michael Kerpan » Fri Mar 21, 2008 6:12 pm

davidhare wrote:You're probably right given the relative obscurity of these thirties titles (I have not seen any of them, and I've probably seen more Mizo than most people.) .
Downfall of Osen is the biggest gem of the three (and it is also available on subbed DVD from Japan -- with benshi narration).

Oyuki is fascinating -- in that one begins thinking of Ford's Stagecoach (not yet made) pretty early on. ;~} Dramatic credibility is not the film's strong point -- but there are some pretty impressive scenes in this.

Poppy made the vaguest impression on me when I watched it. It seemed much closer to Naruse territory than to the flashier sort of stories Mizo was typically working with in this period.

Surely SOMEONE will come out with a decent subbed version of Sisters of Gion.

ptmd
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:12 pm

#73 Post by ptmd » Sat Mar 22, 2008 3:47 am

Surely SOMEONE will come out with a decent subbed version of Sisters of Gion.
Sisters of Gion is a Janus title, they just sent a new print traveling around the country two years ago, and I have it on good authority that it's coming to DVD relatively soon along with the other 30s Mizoguchi films Janus owns (i.e., Story of the Late Chrysanthemums and Osaka Elegy; Janus no longer has prints of the latter, but I'm pretty sure they still have the rights). My guess is that this is a forthcoming Eclipse set, but that's certainly no reason to wait on buying the Carlotta set because it's extremely unlikely that Poppy or Oyuki the Virgin are going to be released on DVD with English subtitles anywhere in the foreseeable future.

User avatar
whaleallright
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 12:56 am

#74 Post by whaleallright » Sat Mar 22, 2008 5:10 pm

I hope the elements they use for the DVD transfers are better than the 35mm print they've been circulating, which was scratchy and washed-out. I have hopes, since the print of SANSHO DAYU that was circulating looked worse than the DVD (which isn't perfect itself).

My guess is that the Japanese rights-owners may have invested in a digital restoration and didn't output that restoration to 35mm, but instead made contact prints to circulate.

ptmd
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:12 pm

#75 Post by ptmd » Sat Mar 22, 2008 5:28 pm

My guess is that the Japanese rights-owners may have invested in a digital restoration and didn't output that restoration to 35mm, but instead made contact prints to circulate.
I think that's exactly right, although, in some cases, the original elements are also in terrible condition. Utamaro is in particularly bad shape, a situation compounded by the fact that apparently the negative no longer exists and everybody has to work from dupe prints. I've seen the Japanese Sisters of the Gion disc and while it looks a bit better than the Janus print (only in terms of scratches, wear, etc.; no matter how good the DVDs look, Mizoguchi's films invariably look and work better on celluloid), it doesn't look nearly as good as, say, the Japanese prints and DVDs of some of the early Ozu films. This is yet another reason why I feel like the 30s and 40s Mizoguchi films that Janus owns are going to end up as an Eclipse set. The Story of the Late Chrysanthemums is as good as anything Mizoguchi ever did, but there's no way they could make it look as good as Ugetsu, Sansho the Bailiff, etc.

Post Reply