Mädchen in Uniform

Discuss releases by the BFI and the films on them.

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Tommaso
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Mädchen in Uniform (Sagan, 1931)

#1 Post by Tommaso » Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:44 am

Holy Smoke! First arthaus (will) release the Jutzi "Alexanderplatz", and now in April this! And yes, it's the 1931 version, not the remake with Romy Schneider from the 50s.
I've never seen this film, but it's considered one of the more daring late Weimar films, so I guess this is a must have. No details on the arthaus site yet, but cover and a bit of info is up at dvd-forum.at.

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Knappen
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#2 Post by Knappen » Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:50 am

Definitely a must have.

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denti alligator
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#3 Post by denti alligator » Tue Feb 05, 2008 12:16 pm

Excellent news!!!

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starmanof51
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#4 Post by starmanof51 » Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:14 pm

Man I wish they'd do English subs. It seems they (arthaus) virtually never do.
Last edited by starmanof51 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 6:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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markhax
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Re: Maedchen in Uniform (Sagan, 1931)

#5 Post by markhax » Tue Feb 05, 2008 4:34 pm

Tommaso wrote:Holy Smoke! First arthaus (will) release the Jutzi "Alexanderplatz", and now in April this! And yes, it's the 1931 version, not the remake with Romy Schneider from the 50s.
I've never seen this film, but it's considered one of the more daring late Weimar films, so I guess this is a must have. No details on the arthaus site yet, but cover and a bit of info is up at dvd-forum.at.
What great news! I have been waiting for years for this to be released. I have seen it--in fact a graduate student of mine wrote a paper on it, so I spent a bit of time with it. It is indeed a bold--and sexy--Weimar film.

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El Manchego
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#6 Post by El Manchego » Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:31 pm

This is great news. I coincidentally had the [dis?]pleasure of seeing a segment of it this afternoon which was simply painful to watch (awful print on VHS). Rather than watch that VHS I think I'll simply wait for this release instead. It's such a shame that so few Weimar films are available these days.

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HerrSchreck
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#7 Post by HerrSchreck » Wed Feb 06, 2008 11:16 pm

Yes indeedy. It'll be interesting to see the state of restoration/elements. I have the ancient Janus HVe VHS of this (probably the one El M mentions above) and the subbing is just awful, definitely one of the worst subbing jobs ever-- I mean this in terms of huuuuuuuuge blocs of the film are unsubbed (worse even than some of the gaps in Kinos MIRROR). It's like the dude sitting at the prompt fell asleep at the wheel. Not only that but the font actually changes at one point where it seems Janus plugged a hole in the reel elements they had with telecine from another preexisting transfer. If I'm not mistaken this is where the huge sub holes are.

Nonetheless its a rich and hugely rewarding film, and brave in the blatancy of its statement. The anti-authoritarian aspect of the film vs the storm brewing in Weimar at the time is pretty head on and uncouched. Leontine Sagan was just basically saying a naked Fuck You to the nazi's and the structural traditionalists on Germany moaning for Old Time Teutonic Regimentation & Suppression.

Eleanor Roosevelt had a lot to do with the re emergence of this film just after its first go round (whereby I believe it was surpressed even here in the US). She saw it, was blown away and busted that shit out and made sure it got its due.

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El Manchego
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#8 Post by El Manchego » Thu Feb 07, 2008 12:05 am

HerrSchreck wrote:Yes indeedy. It'll be interesting to see the state of restoration/elements. I have the ancient Janus HVe VHS of this (probably the one El M mentions above) and the subbing is just awful, definitely one of the worst subbing jobs ever-- I mean this in terms of huuuuuuuuge blocs of the film are unsubbed (worse even than some of the gaps in Kinos MIRROR). It's like the dude sitting at the prompt fell asleep at the wheel. Not only that but the font actually changes at one point where it seems Janus plugged a hole in the reel elements they had with telecine from another preexisting transfer. If I'm not mistaken this is where the huge sub holes are.
That's the one! Not to mention where there are actually subs they have no contrast against any white backgrounds rendering them almost entirely useless.

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Tommaso
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#9 Post by Tommaso » Thu Feb 07, 2008 7:40 am

Good to hear that so many people are also excited about this release. But I fear that for most of you the release will probably be useless, as indeed arthaus practically never put subs on their discs. Also it should be noted that this is not in their new 'Premium' series, so I doubt that this will be a new restoration or something.

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Via_Chicago
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#10 Post by Via_Chicago » Thu Feb 07, 2008 1:05 pm

Yes, there's no longer a good print of this in the States. We screened Janus' 16mm print here in Chicago this past summer and it was one of the most unbearable 16mm prints that I have ever seen (it also has the same subtitle problems that the VHS apparently has). It was so bad that we asked Janus to retire the print. Yikes! :?

I really do want to echo Schreck's sentiments though, since it is indeed quite a wonderful little film. All of the leads are first rate, and Sagan keeps the thing moving along at a nice clip. It is, along with some of Pabst's late films, and Mabuse, one of the last great gasps of the Weimar cinema. Hopefully, we'll get a subtitled, restored print here some day.

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HerrSchreck
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#11 Post by HerrSchreck » Thu Feb 07, 2008 4:41 pm

I have little doubt that if good materials of this film ever surface, or the pre-existing materials can be worked to Miracle Status (see 3Penny CC versus what was done w that previosuly cruddy looking old dupe neg used for the washed out old Janus VHS of the same vintage & pedigree as the Machden), this would receive the CC treatment. No doubt whatsoever.

This hinges of course on the viability of the materials vs CC QC dept.

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denti alligator
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#12 Post by denti alligator » Thu Feb 07, 2008 5:03 pm

If a German script is easily available, maybe those of us who know German can muster our resources and time and make a translation for subtitling the arte disc. I'd certainly help, if only because a subbed version would be helpful in certain teaching situations.

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markhax
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#13 Post by markhax » Thu Feb 07, 2008 6:03 pm

HerrSchreck wrote:Eleanor Roosevelt had a lot to do with the re emergence of this film just after its first go round (whereby I believe it was surpressed even here in the US). She saw it, was blown away and busted that shit out and made sure it got its due.
This is really interesting, Schreck. Do you remember where you found this information?

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SoyCuba
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#14 Post by SoyCuba » Thu Feb 07, 2008 9:42 pm

I saw this on TV some time ago and it is indeed an amazing film. Anyway, from what I remember, the image quality was quite good and I suspect that fairly good materials do exist.

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HerrSchreck
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#15 Post by HerrSchreck » Fri Feb 08, 2008 3:37 am

Well I don't know if I ever heard the Eleanor was a dyke (she may well have been, but that's conjecture on a lot of parts), but even if she was, the film was just the all around perfect package considering the wave of fascism sweeping the world. Leontine Sagan could have drawn the same portrait without the juvenile-unisex-quartered form of innocent sexual groping/affection (that occurs quite often during the discovery stage and isn't a promise of homosexuality in maturity) and it still would have been a home run... it's a great film first and foremost. And it was the honesty of the youthfulness and suffering on display which I think had a lot to do with how moved folks were. This was not common stuff.

Mark I think I read about the Roosevelt connection in one of my Wiemar Cinema books... the only thing I could come up in a (very brief) search was from IMDb:
The movie was banned when first released in Germany and the United States. It wasn't until First Lady Roosevelt, Eleanor saw the importance of the movie that the ban was lifted.

rollotomassi
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#16 Post by rollotomassi » Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:26 pm

My guess would be the BFI will eventually whack English subs on this as they released an excellent VHS of this in the UK in the 90s with perfect subs. It was released alongside Slatan Dodow's Kuhle Wampe, and both are over due the DVD upgrade they have given Kurosawa (initially badly), Dreyer and others.

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Ornette
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#17 Post by Ornette » Fri Apr 04, 2008 1:43 pm

It's a really wonderful film and I've a rip of the BFI VHS which'd be used to create custom subs. In fact, I and another member of this forum have actually entertained the thought of doing so. We'll see how that goes along.

Even though there's something about it that puts me off a bit (that white outlining perhaps), I must say that I quite like the cover -- intriguing, in any case.

Image

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HerrSchreck
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#18 Post by HerrSchreck » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:23 pm

We must badger our local linguistics experts around here Knappen & Denti Alligator to properly sub this film. Even if we hafta *cough* frame them for some kinda awful crime, and hold out the proof that they DIDNT commit them as ransom for the subbing job. Especially if the transfer is miles ahead of the Janus/HVe. (Not holding my breath though).

Maybe the poster above is right, and the BFI will at least come up with something.

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domino harvey
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#19 Post by domino harvey » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:39 pm

Image

I believe the word we're all searching for is "SCHWING"

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HerrSchreck
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#20 Post by HerrSchreck » Fri Apr 04, 2008 4:49 pm

When I put up my last post there was a problem with the link for that cover, and it was just a box w a red X.

SO:

Amos Poe?

Or a combination of Lilian Gish and Dorian Gray?

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Kinsayder
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#21 Post by Kinsayder » Sat Apr 19, 2008 6:14 am

I don't think Arthaus have done much work on this. Image is soft and grainy. Optional German subs only. No extras to speak of.

Image
Image
Image
Image

English translation: "Stop whining"

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colinr0380
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#22 Post by colinr0380 » Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:05 am

Those Germans are very verbose! :D

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skuhn8
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#23 Post by skuhn8 » Sat Apr 19, 2008 9:26 am

Perhaps a little heavy on softness and grain, but I'll bet it looks just fine in motion. Excellent for an unmanipulated film from '31. Will definitely have to get this.

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HerrSchreck
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#24 Post by HerrSchreck » Sun Apr 20, 2008 7:47 am

I'd actually venture they did a little work on it, vs the element seen on the Janus, which is probably the same source. It has the same soft look, but the contrast looks restored, and damage probably MTI'd to a light-to-moderate extent.

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Tommaso
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#25 Post by Tommaso » Sun Jun 08, 2008 6:53 am

I feel the urgent need to revive this thread after having watched the disc last night. This was even better than I hoped for after the comments here. The most fascinating thing for me is the ambiguity of the film; is it about Prussian education and authoritarianism, is it about homosexuality, what exactly is the nature of the relationship between Thiele and Wieck? The attraction clearly goes both ways, and it's fascinating how quickly Wieck can change from sympathetic schoolmistress to an almost demonical character. There's one shot where she stands behind Thiele apparently to soothe her, but with a look that suggests a vampirical attitude that seems to come straight out of "Nosferatu". These filmmakers clearly knew their Weimar silent cinema history, unsurprisingly, and the fantastic use of light and shade easily transforms the institute into something very close to a gothic castle in many scenes. Whatever the importance of the film may be from a sociological standpoint, it's first and foremost an incredibly intense visual masterpiece. Those close-ups.... are we talking Bergman here?!

I don't find that arthaus edition all too bad, btw. The print used clearly is several generations down from the negative, resulting in that somewhat blurry and grainy image, but it's well transferred, sound is very clear and easy to understand, and there may have indeed been some scratch removal at work. The only serious flaw is (again) the aspect ratio. This was clearly shot in 1.19, and as a result with this full frame transfer we get the usual chopped heads (not apparent in the caps above, but very clearly and sometimes disturbingly visible in other shots). Will these dvd producers never learn....? All in all, I would rate this disc higher than the arthaus "Alexanderplatz" in print and transfer terms.

As to the extras: more than seem to be there at first glance. There are two highly illuminating pdf-files on the disc, one being a scholarly essay on the film and other films by Thiele and Wieck (most notably a film called "Anna und Elisabeth" from 1933, which seems to tackle similar issues, does anyone know it?), the other a fantastic interview with Thiele from the 1980s. If you can read German and care to print these files, you probably get the equivalent of a very good MoC booklet here. The good thing about these documents is that they shed an interesting light on the film's reception over the years. While it seems to have been initially regarded mainly as an indictment of Prussian authoritarianism, since the 70s it was apparently highlighted as the first film dealing with lesbian issues or at least as a first example of decidedly female filmmaking (as opposed to a male perspective). It is indeed surprising that these latter aspects seem to have gone almost unnoticed when the film first came out, but it is equally interesting that Hertha Thiele points out that actually Leontine Sagan knew nothing about filmmaking and had to work very closely with 'artistic supervisor' Carl Froehlich and the male cameraman and crew not just for approval of what she was doing, but also apparently to get things right in the first place. Apparently it was also Froehlich who decided to tone down the lesbian overtones of the story and who devised the ending (in the original play, Manuela actually jumps out of the window and kills herself, which is of course changed here). One wonders how much this actually is really a film directed by Sagan, and whether Froehlich shouldn't deserve at least additional directorial credits, making the whole argument about it being a 'female' film somewhat dubious. I find this reception history interesting because it shows how critics can twist and narrow a film's meaning to shape it to their needs (Kracauer's reading being another, though different example); clearly the things Thiele brings up in that interview are not necessarily to the liking of her feminist interviewers, but thankfully they give us Thiele's views in full.

Anyway, as I said initially, I'm stunned, and the film is a great example of how well Weimar cinema was thriving in the early 30s and how smoothly the transition from silent to sound films was managed in Germany, at least occasionally. All this was lost from 1933 on, of course, resulting in an endless string of second-rate comedies and other entertainment films. But these very early German sound films seem to deserve much more attention in general, and they are even less known than the great silent classics over here. Good to see that arthaus managed to get this one out then, despite the aspect ratio flaw. Now, can we please have this in 1.19 from MoC soon?!!!

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