Eclipse Random Speculation

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Arn777 · #1 Post by **Arn777** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:21 pm

Probably best to put this here as it is different from what Eclipse was supposed to be about.

There is a one page article in the new issue of Cahiers du Cinema, the article ends on what Eclipse is going to be: A cheaper line with no supplements apart from the trailer, 12 titles per year starting with early Bergman, Les croix de Bois (Raymond Bernard - 1931), some Gremillion, some Le Chanois. The article is based on an discussion with Fumiko Takagi.

That's all it says.

denti alligator · #2 Post by **denti alligator** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:01 pm

If this is tue, why create a separate line? Why not just create a $15.99 or $19.99 tier release?

Simon · #3 Post by **Simon** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:01 pm

Basically a HVE replacement.

Michael Kerpan · #4 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:03 pm

Perhaps this new line will allow for the release of some of the (virtually) unrestoreable older Ozu films.

Gregory · #5 Post by **Gregory** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:19 pm

If this is true, why create a separate line? Why not just create a $15.99 or $19.99 tier release?

Because Criterion is known for having great supplements. There have always been some exceptions to that, but I think they want to make a distinct separation to create a clearer justification for the more expensive releases.

I'm extremely happy with this news. Extra features are nice, of course, but I almost never have time to fully explore them anyway. (Also, I've never believed in listening to entire commentaries. Interesting things are said occasionally but I just don't like to experience the film that way.) By far the most important thing to me is that a film becomes available with a good transfer. This will permit the release of a lot of titles that many people have been waiting for endlessly, which would unfortunately sell for crap at a higher price point. I just wish they were doing more than 12 a year.

miless · #6 Post by **miless** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:23 pm

Gregory wrote:I just wish they were doing more than 12 a year.

with all the films that Criterion supposedly owns the rights to, you'd think they could put out at least double that amount.

#7 Post by **zedz** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:34 pm

Why look a gift horse in the mouth? For me, this is far more exciting news than what the old Eclipse line was rumoured to be. It sounds like it will allow Criterion to take some more risks in their selection (much as it depresses me to consider Gremillon as 'risky'). There are plenty of existing releases that are similarly bare-bones (or might as well be), so the lower price point will be most welcome.

Doctor Sunshine · #8 Post by **Doctor Sunshine** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:38 pm

miless wrote:with all the films that Criterion supposedly owns the rights to, you'd think they could put out at least double that amount.

They're essentially selling to the same market and they've talked about cannibalizing themselves before with too many films a month. But if it goes well I'm sure it'd be sped up.

Cinephrenic · #9 Post by **Cinephrenic** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:39 pm

It all makes sense. A good move I think. I mean I always wondered how they would distribute the lesser regarded films of directors they owned the rights to. I think this will bring out more titles faster, even though 12 titles per year is not all that great.

The Men Who Tread on the Tiger's Tail
No Regrets for Our Youth
One Wonderful Sunday
The Quiet Duel
The Rite
The Devil's Eye
A Lesson in Love
Secrets of Women
From the Life of the Marionettes
The Munekata Sisters
The Brothers and Sisters of the Toda Family
Gervaise

#10 Post by **zedz** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:43 pm

And all those silent Ozus!

(I think that's the first time I've felt the need for an emoticon)

Tribe · #11 Post by **Tribe** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:50 pm

I agree with Simon. HVE was traditionally the place where Criterion would place their "second tier" (for lack of a better term) releases. This also confirms that HVE is indeed dead as dead and the last trickle of so-called HVE releases coming out of Image are films that HVE was contractually obligated to release.

Nice pricing scheme though...HVE releases tended to be below Criterion levels, but also a little above the rest of the market.

Tribe

Gregory · #12 Post by **Gregory** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 4:50 pm

The Quiet Duel came out just over a month ago in R1.

Michael Kerpan · #13 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:11 pm

I wonder if Criterion has the rights to Ozu's "Munekata Sisters" -- this is not a Shochiku film -- but a Shintoho film that now belongs to Toho. .

Cinesimilitude · #14 Post by **Cinesimilitude** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:17 pm

This is great news If the prices are right. I'll probably buy every title.

Steven H · #15 Post by **Steven H** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:24 pm

If this is going to happen, I hope it's more sooner than later. It could be possible that if Eclipse doesn't get going it might get lost in the shuffle if there's a HD push down the line. With all the titles at their disposal, it would be a boon to film lovers around the world.

tryavna · #16 Post by **tryavna** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:29 pm

Tribe wrote:I agree with Simon. HVE was traditionally the place where Criterion would place their "second tier" (for lack of a better term) releases.

Yeah, Arn's original post sounds like it could have described many an HVe release: Drole du Drame, M. Klein, Seance on a Wet Afternoon, etc. Seems like Eclipse will pick up nicely where HVe left off -- only with slightly lower prices to begin with.

I'm quite happy about this. I do hope, however, that they'll at least include liner notes. Sometimes, liner notes were all an HVe release needed (like Drole du Drame), but they were still a big help in contextualizing the films themselves.

Michael Kerpan · #17 Post by **Michael Kerpan** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:34 pm

kinjitsu wrote:
Michael Kerpan wrote:I wonder if Criterion has the rights to Ozu's "Munekata Sisters"
It would be wonderful if they do have the rights. Just read Bordwell's comments & am all the more interested in seeing the film one day.

I wasn't a big fan of this -- at least in it's French-subtitled Video version. Some good bits, but it feels like an "Ozu movie" more than it feels like a film made by Ozu. (Ozu had less control of script, casting and technical crew than for any other late film).

Lino · #18 Post by **Lino** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 5:39 pm

I think this is just a marketing gimmick to get people to buy important titles at a lower price tag. That way, they can get away with releasing them as bare-bones editions.

God knows just how many times I've heard people on this forum complaining about the fact that they're paying far too much money on a title with only liner notes as extras (or the solitary trailer). It seems that they've found the perfect excuse now.

Not that I'm complaining though -- I've stopped buying as many Criterions as I'd like to long ago because it just didn't justify paying such high prices for a single film or multiple film releases (Warner, you know you are my darling now!).

Still, it would be kind of sad if they'll release Bergman's Summer with Monika with no audio commentary or filmed interviews with the actors, though. See, the complaints have already begun...

#19 Post by **Matt** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:00 pm

Lino wrote:Still, it would be kind of sad if they'll release Bergman's Summer with Monika with no audio commentary or filmed interviews with the actors, though. See, the complaints have already begun...

Would you rather they release it without supplements or not release it at all because they didn't have sufficient supplements? I know I'd always prefer the former, regardless of the film.

Lino · #20 Post by **Lino** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:07 pm

Matt wrote:
Lino wrote:Still, it would be kind of sad if they'll release Bergman's Summer with Monika with no audio commentary or filmed interviews with the actors, though. See, the complaints have already begun...
Would you rather they release it without supplements or not release it at all because they didn't have sufficient supplements? I know I'd always prefer the former, regardless of the film.

They would always release it, regardless of having supplements or not. Just look at Autumn Sonata.

The big question with Criterion is "when". But hey, like I said with The Gang's All Here release being part of an Alice Faye Collection -- "as long as they keep coming out..." Now, the big difference is that a Fox Marquee title does have supplements for the price of an Eclipse...

Oh, well -- today I'm inconsolable so I have to take it out on something. Oh, the boredom of it all...

#21 Post by **Matt** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:39 pm

Lino wrote:They would always release it, regardless of having supplements or not. Just look at Autumn Sonata.

I don't understand how this supports your argument. Autumn Sonata has a commentary and an alternate English dub track. And it was a very early release.

redbill · #22 Post by **redbill** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:51 pm

It could also be for films that they don't have "criterion acceptable" transfers for...

Lino · #23 Post by **Lino** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 6:53 pm

Matt wrote:
Lino wrote:They would always release it, regardless of having supplements or not. Just look at Autumn Sonata.
I don't understand how this supports your argument. Autumn Sonata has a commentary and an alternate English dub track. And it was a very early release.

Oh, yeah -- you're right. I forgot. It's close to midnight over here, so you'll understand. Hmm, let's see if I can think of another title...

Really can't right now but there's lots of single titles that I still feel reluctant to buying them because of their high price. But I still maintain my initial stand that this is all a clever marketing gimmick. Don't get me wrong -- I hope it works out ok for them. We, after all, are the biggest beneficiaries.

jon · #24 Post by **jon** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:01 pm

This is extremely exciting for me. The prospect of the Ozus has me particularly excited. The oppurtunity to see some of these films that I would otherwise not get to see is great, especially at a price point that might allow me to buy every title. Twelve titles is kind of weak, but I am assuming that they are going to test the waters first.

Also, what is going to happen with HD? ><

#25 Post by **Matt** » Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:03 pm

Lino wrote:
Matt wrote:
Lino wrote:They would always release it, regardless of having supplements or not. Just look at Autumn Sonata.
I don't understand how this supports your argument. Autumn Sonata has a commentary and an alternate English dub track. And it was a very early release.
Oh, yeah -- you're right. I forgot. It's close to midnight over here, so you'll understand. Hmm, let's see if I can think of another title...

High and Low? Vagabond? Cleo from 5 to 7? Variety Lights? Alphaville? None of those even have so much as a trailer (but some are rumored reissues). The Long Good Friday, Summertime, Picnic at Hanging Rock, Shock Corridor, and The Naked Kiss have only the trailer.