1940s List Discussion and Suggestions (Lists Project Vol. 3)

An ongoing survey of the Criterion Forum membership to create lists of the best films of each decade and genre.
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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#651 Post by swo17 » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:01 pm

Are you insinuating that the Oscars are a lie?

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knives
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm

Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#652 Post by knives » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:03 pm

It's a factoid that the oscars are good.

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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#653 Post by swo17 » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:06 pm

I think it's pretty clear which results will be discussed more around water coolers everywhere tomorrow morning.

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domino harvey
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#654 Post by domino harvey » Sun Feb 26, 2012 11:08 pm

Like you're going to have thirty-five hundred BBCode tags ready by sunup

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matrixschmatrix
Joined: Tue May 25, 2010 11:26 pm

Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#655 Post by matrixschmatrix » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:00 am

When is the actual deadline, anyway? It's midnight where I am.

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domino harvey
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#656 Post by domino harvey » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:02 am

Don't feed Mogwai, then

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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#657 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:03 am

matrixschmatrix wrote:When is the actual deadline, anyway? It's midnight where I am.
The earlier the better at this point, but I will accept anything submitted to me by about the time I get up tomorrow, around 8 AM Mountain Time.

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thirtyframesasecond
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 1:48 pm

Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#658 Post by thirtyframesasecond » Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:58 am

knives wrote:I actually tried to breed discussion on Zeman earlier. He's a really great and underrated animator.
I gave it a pretty decent vote so fingers crossed it does well. Might've been my second highest short actually.

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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#659 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:24 pm

Many thanks to everyone who participated in the project this round. I'll be posting the results shortly in the next three posts. Once again, here is a guide to what the figures listed after each film represent, each separated with a slash mark:

1. Total points (50 for each #1 placement, 49 for each #2, etc.)
2. Number of lists the film appeared on (out of 33 submitted). If the film appeared in anyone's top 10, the number of top 10 appearances is also denoted in parentheses.
3. Highest placement of the film on any one list. If more than one person ranked the film this high, this is also denoted in parentheses.
4. Change in position from the 2006 list, with movements of 10 or more highlighted.

So for example, the 388/13(2)/8(x2)/-6 shown for My Darling Clementine means that it scored 388 points and appeared on 13 lists (and two top 10s), with two people ranking it as high as #8. The film also moved down six positions from its placement on the 2006 list.

For the list of orphans, only figure #3 is displayed.

The 1950s thread will start in the next couple days. In the meantime, feel free to discuss the results in this thread, or to defend your poor faring favorites here.

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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#660 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:25 pm

The 1940s List

01. Citizen Kane (Orson Welles, 1941) 875/27(10)/1(x4)/+1
02. Late Spring (Yasujirô Ozu, 1949) 789/21(10)/1(x2)/-1
03. The Red Shoes (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1948) 768/22(9)/1(x2)/+11
04. The Third Man (Carol Reed, 1949) 727/21(10)/1(x2)/--
05. Ivan the Terrible (Sergei Eisenstein, 1944/6) 658/18(10)/1(x3)/+1
06. Black Narcissus (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1947) 652/21(5)/1/+20
07. Casablanca (Michael Curtiz, 1942) 610/18(7)/1(x2)/+15
08. Letter from an Unknown Woman (Max Ophüls, 1948) 553/17(5)/1(x2)/+19
09. Beauty and the Beast (Jean Cocteau, 1946) 551/19(6)/4/--
10. Day of Wrath (Carl Dreyer, 1943) 506/19(4)/3/-7
11. Notorious (Alfred Hitchcock, 1946) 504/16(7)/2(x2)/-6
12. Out of the Past (Jacques Tourneur, 1947) 499/16(4)/1/-3
13. The Lady from Shanghai (Orson Welles, 1944) 466/15(3)/3/+7
14. The Big Sleep (Howard Hawks, 1946) 460/17(2)/3/+15
15. The Magnificent Ambersons (Orson Welles, 1942) 454/17(3)/8/-8
16. The Best Years of Our Lives (William Wyler, 1946) 431/12(4)/4/+24
17. Ladri di biciclette (Vittorio De Sica, 1948) 422/14(5)/2(x2)/-9
18. Rebecca (Alfred Hitchcock, 1940) 421/15(4)/2/+44
19. Shadow of a Doubt (Alfred Hitchcock, 1943) 402/15(1)/8/+34
20. Children of Paradise (Marcel Carné, 1945) 394/13(4)/1/--
21. My Darling Clementine (John Ford, 1946) 388/13(2)/8(x2)/-6
22. Brief Encounter (David Lean, 1945) 382/18(3)/4/+3
23. The Lady Eve (Preston Sturges, 1941) 380/12(4)/3(x3)/-12
24. Double Indemnity (Billy Wilder, 1944) 373/13(4)/1/-7
25. A Matter of Life and Death (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1946) 372/13(4)/1/+32
26. A Canterbury Tale (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1944) 354/13(4)/1/-2
27. I Know Where I'm Going! (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1945) 349/11(3)/3/+18
28. I Walked with a Zombie (Jacques Tourneur, 1943) 348/12(2)/6(x2)/+18
(tie) Laura (Otto Preminger, 1944) 348/14(1)/9/+6
30. The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1943) 344/13(4)/2/-7
31. Kind Hearts and Coronets (Robert Hamer, 1949) 343/11(4)/2/+13
(tie) His Girl Friday (Howard Hawks, 1940) 343/15(2)/4/-19
33. Meet Me in St. Louis (Vincente Minnelli, 1944) 342/11(4)/6/+20
34. The Curse of the Cat People (Gunther von Fritsch & Robert Wise, 1944) 302/11(2)/5/+43
35. Red River (Howard Hawks, 1948) 298/12(2)/4/+60
36. To Be or Not to Be (Ernst Lubitsch, 1942) 296/10(4)/1/+1
37. Germany, Year Zero (Roberto Rossellini, 1948) 282/9(3)/2/+28
38. White Heat (Raoul Walsh, 1949) 281/14/14(x2)/-22
39. The Palm Beach Story (Preston Sturges, 1942) 280/9(2)/5/-4
40. Force of Evil (Abraham Polonsky, 1948) 278/9(4)/3/+6
41. The Maltese Falcon (John Huston, 1941) 277/11(2)/3/+9
42. Scarlet Street (Fritz Lang, 1945) 271/11/11(x2)/-3
43. Le Corbeau (Henri-Georges Clouzot, 1943) 267/9(3)/2/+18
(tie) La terra trema (Luchino Visconti, 1948) 267/8(2)/3(x2)/+8
45. The Treasure of the Sierra Madre (John Huston, 1948) 261/11(1)/1/-8
46. Meshes of the Afternoon (Maya Deren & Alexander Hammid, 1943) 258/10(1)/5/-27
47. Sullivan's Travels (Preston Sturges, 1941) 250/9(1)/4/-34
48. Hail the Conquering Hero (Preston Sturges, 1944) 247/8(3)/2(x2)/+70
49. The Seventh Victim (Mark Robson, 1943) 245/8(3)/3/+39
50. Paisan (Roberto Rossellini, 1946) 234/9(2)/6/+66
51. Begone Dull Care (Norman McLaren & Evelyn Lambart, 1949) 230/7(1)/6/+24
52. Great Expectations (David Lean, 1946) 226/7(3)/4/New
53. The Miracle of Morgan's Creek (Preston Sturges, 1944) 223/9(2)/4/+57
(tie) Pinocchio (Ben Sharpsteen & Hamilton Luske, 1940) 223/8(1)/3/+18
55. Cat People (Jacques Tourneur, 1942) 220/10(1)/4/-24
56. Stray Dog (Akira Kurosawa, 1949) 218/7(2)/6/-15
57. Went the Day Well? (Alberto Cavalcanti, 1942) 213/7(3)/6/New
(tie) The Grapes of Wrath (John Ford, 1940) 213/10/14/+49
59. Rome, Open City (Roberto Rossellini, 1945) 212/9(2)/2/-31
60. The Shop Around the Corner (Ernst Lubitsch, 1940) 209/7(1)/6/-42
61. Le Silence de la mer (Jean-Pierre Melville, 1948) 208/6(4)/5(x2)/+39
62. Fantasia (James Algar et al, 1940) 206/9(3)/3/-29
63. The Fallen Idol (Carol Reed, 1948) 202/8/12/+49
64. To Have and Have Not (Howard Hawks, 1944) 201/9(1)/4/-34
65. The Pirate (Vincente Minnelli, 1948) 200/7(1)/4/+80
66. It's a Wonderful Life (Frank Capra, 1946) 198/7(3)/2(x2)/-31
(tie) The Devil and Daniel Webster (William Dieterle, 1941) 198/7(2)/5/+32
68. The Ghost and Mrs. Muir (Joseph Mankiewicz, 1947) 193/8(2)/3/New
69. Raw Deal (Anthony Mann, 1948) 189/6(1)/9/+40
70. How Green Was My Valley (John Ford, 1941) 183/6(1)/8/+89
71. Fort Apache (John Ford, 1948) 182/6(1)/6/+15
(tie) Ball of Fire (Howard Hawks, 1941) 182/7(1)/1/New
73. Fires Were Started (Humphrey Jennings, 1943) 180/6(2)/4/+50
74. The Shanghai Gesture (Josef von Sternberg, 1941) 173/5(3)/5(x2)/+43
75. Odd Man Out (Carol Reed, 1947) 172/6(1)/9/+82
76. Blood of the Beasts (Georges Franju, 1949) 167/6(2)/2/-7
77. The Ox-Bow Incident (William Wellman, 1943) 165/8(1)/9/+5
78. Dumbo (Ben Sharpsteen, 1941) 157/6(1)/10/+42
79. Good News (Charles Walters, 1947) 156/5/14/New
80. Heaven Can Wait (Ernst Lubitsch, 1943) 153/7(1)/6/-8
81. Unter den Brücken (Helmut Käutner, 1946) 150/4(2)/1/New
82. Nightmare Alley (Edmund Goulding, 1947) 144/5/13(x2)/-19
83. I Was a Male War Bride (Howard Hawks, 1949) 143/6(2)/9/New
84. The Murderers Are Among Us (Wolfgang Staudte, 1946) 142/5(1)/9/New
85. Brute Force (Jules Dassin, 1947) 136/9(1)/10/-30
86. Ossessione (Luchino Visconti, 1943) 135/5(1)/9/-26
87. Monsieur Verdoux (Charles Chaplin, 1947) 134/5(1)/8/-55
88. Hangover Square (John Brahm, 1945) 132/4(2)/5/New
89. Les Visiteurs du soir (Marcel Carné, 1942) 130/4(1)/9/New
90. The Philadelphia Story (George Cukor, 1940) 129/6/18/-14
91. Air Force (Howard Hawks, 1943) 128/4(1)/3/New
92. The Heiress (William Wyler, 1949) 127/4(1)/2/New
93. She Wore a Yellow Ribbon (John Ford, 1949) 126/5(1)/10/+43
(tie) The Set-Up (Robert Wise, 1949) 126/7(1)/10/-2
95. There Was a Father (Yasujirô Ozu, 1942) 125/4(1)/7/-47
96. Listen to Britain (Humphrey Jennings & Stewart McAllister, 1942) 123/3(2)/2/New
(tie) The Small Back Room (Michael Powell & Emeric Pressburger, 1949) 123/4(1)/1/New
(tie) The Woman in the Window (Fritz Lang, 1944) 123/6/16/New
99. Ritual in Transfigured Time (Maya Deren, 1946) 122/3(2)/2/+42
(tie) The Chase (Arthur Ripley, 1946) 122/5(1)/5/New
(tie) A Hen in the Wind (Yasujirô Ozu, 1948) 122/5(1)/4/+3


Top Directors

Michael Powell (8 films, 3062 points)
Emeric Pressburger (7 films, 2962 points)
Orson Welles (5 films, 1892 points)
Howard Hawks (8 films, 1782 points)
Alfred Hitchcock (12 films, 1765 points)
Preston Sturges (9 films, 1589 points)
John Ford (8 films, 1282 points)
Jacques Tourneur (6 films, 1192 points)
Yasujirô Ozu (5 films, 1171 points)
Carol Reed (5 films, 1148 points)

Michael Curtiz (4 films, 796 points)
Ernst Lubitsch (4 films, 767 points)
Vincente Minnelli (9 films, 762 points)
Max Ophüls (4 films, 749 points)
Roberto Rossellini (3 films, 728 points)
David Lean (6 films, 703 points)
Raoul Walsh (9 films, 685 points)
William Wyler (7 films, 676 points)
John Huston (5 films, 676 points)
Sergei Eisenstein (1 film, 658 points)

Ben Sharpsteen (3 films, 586 points)
Otto Preminger (5 films, 566 points)
Robert Hamer (5 films, 564 points)
Jean Cocteau (1 film, 551 points)
Marcel Carné (2 films, 524 points)
Carl Dreyer (1 film, 506 points)
Fritz Lang (3 films, 464 points)
Billy Wilder (3 films, 447 points)
Alberto Cavalcanti (3 films, 445 points)
Robert Wise (3 films, 437 points)

Humphrey Jennings (5 films, 435 points)
Vittorio De Sica (3 films, 431 points)
Hamilton Luske (2 films, 429 points)
Luchino Visconti (2 films, 402 points)
Maya Deren (3 films, 401 points)
Anthony Mann (5 films, 389 points)
Henri-Georges Clouzot (3 films, 374 points)
Akira Kurosawa (4 films, 352 points)
Hiroshi Shimizu (4 films, 337 points)
William Wellman (5 films, 336 points)

Mark Robson (3 films, 316 points)
William Dieterle (2 films, 310 points)
Gunther von Fritsch (1 film, 302 points)
Jean Grémillon (4 films, 295 points)
Joseph Mankiewicz (4 films, 289 points)
Sam Wood (5 films, 289 points)
Abraham Polonsky (1 film, 278 points)
George Cukor (4 films, 242 points)
Norman McLaren (2 films, 241 points)
Helmut Käutner (4 films, 228 points)

Non-directors that also fared well:
Val Lewton (7 films, 1204 points)
Ealing Studios (11 films, 925 points)
Walt Disney (7 films, 768 points)


Graphic Results

Image Image Image


About 60% of the votes and points generated from all the lists related to films from the U.S. Here is how the rest of the world fared:

ImageImage


Casualties from the 2006 List

41. Thieves' Highway (now an also-ran)
43. Quai des Orfèvres (now an also-ran)
49. Les Dames du Bois de Boulogne (now an also-ran)
52. Rope (now an also-ran)
56. They Live by Night (now an also-ran)
58. Spring in a Small Town (now an also-ran)
59. The Killers (now an also-ran)
64. The Leopard Man (now an orphan)
65. The Brothers and Sisters of the Toda Family (now an orphan)
67. Pursued (now an also-ran)
68. Unfaithfully Yours (now an also-ran)
69. Fireworks (now an also-ran)
72. King-Size Canary (now an also-ran)
74. T-Men (now an also-ran)
77. Louisiana Story (now an orphan)
77. Pattes blanches (now an also-ran)
80. At Land (now an also-ran)
81. The 47 Ronin (now an also-ran)
83. The Fountainhead (now voteless)
84. Jour de fête (now an orphan)
85. Kiss of Death (now an also-ran)
87. The Naked City (now an also-ran)
89. Red Hot Riding Hood (now an also-ran)
89. Shoeshine (now an also-ran)
91. Caught (now an orphan)
93. Bad Luck Blackie (now an also-ran)
93. La Tempestaire (now an orphan)
96. Christmas in July (now an also-ran)
97. Detour (now an also-ran)
99. Record of a Tenement Gentleman (now an also-ran)
Last edited by swo17 on Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:30 am, edited 1 time in total.

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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#661 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:27 pm

Also-Rans

Dead of Night (Alberto Cavalcanti et al, 1945) 121/4(1)/8/New
Mildred Pierce (Michael Curtiz, 1945) 121/5/13/+29
Leave Her to Heaven (John Stahl, 1945) 119/6/14/+38
Record of a Tenement Gentleman (Yasujirô Ozu, 1948) 115/5(1)/9/-6
The Killers (Robert Siodmak, 1946) 115/7/14/-46
Opfergang (Veit Harlan, 1944) 114/4(2)/6/New
The Reckless Moment (Max Ophüls, 1949) 114/6(1)/7/+14
Lumière d'été (Jean Grémillon, 1943) 113/3(2)/6/+10
All the King's Men (Robert Rossen, 1949) 112/4(1)/5/+59
Portrait of Jennie (William Dieterle, 1948) 112/4(1)/10/New

They Made Me a Fugitive (Alberto Cavalcanti, 1947) 111/3(2)/1/New
Bambi (David Hand, 1942) 111/5/22/+48
Cluny Brown (Ernst Lubitsch, 1946) 109/6/15/New
The Long Voyage Home (John Ford, 1940) 106/3(1)/7/+11
Notes of an Itinerant Performer (Hiroshi Shimizu, 1941) 104/4/15/New
Münchhausen (Josef von Báky, 1943) 104/5/16/New
The Strawberry Blonde (Raoul Walsh, 1941) 101/3(1)/4/New
Ohara Shôsuke-san (Hiroshi Shimizu, 1949) 101/3(1)/2/New
The Thief of Bagdad (Ludwig Berger et al, 1940) 100/3/12/New
Yellow Sky (William Wellman, 1948) 98/3(2)/7/New

Christmas in July (Preston Sturges, 1940) 98/4(1)/4/-25
Lifeboat (Alfred Hitchcock, 1944) 97/4/17/+39
A Diary for Timothy (Humphrey Jennings, 1945) 96/3(2)/2/New
Motion Painting No. 1 (Oskar Fischinger, 1947) 96/3(1)/1/+8
High Sierra (Raoul Walsh, 1941) 96/4(1)/7/+1
Whirlpool (Otto Preminger, 1949) 95/2(2)/1/New
Canyon Passage (Jacques Tourneur, 1946) 93/2(2)/2/New
T-Men (Anthony Mann, 1947) 92/4(1)/9/-55
Pursued (Raoul Walsh, 1947) 92/6/13/-62
The Great Dictator (Charles Chaplin, 1940) 91/5(1)/4/-28

Our Town (Sam Wood, 1940) 90/3/12/New
Gaslight (George Cukor, 1944) 89/3(1)/8/New
Quai des Orfèvres (Henri-Georges Clouzot, 1947) 88/3(1)/6/-91
Key Largo (John Huston, 1948) 87/6(1)/3/-31
They Live by Night (Nicholas Ray, 1948) 86/3(1)/1/-80
Une si jolie petite plage (Yves Allégret, 1949) 83/2(1)/5/New
Now, Voyager (Irving Rapper, 1942) 83/4/13/-3
Madame Bovary (Vincente Minnelli, 1949) 82/2(1)/9/New
La perla (Emilio Fernández, 1947) 82/4(1)/10/New
Der verzauberte Tag (Peter Pewas, 1944) 80/2(1)/8/New

Bad Luck Blackie (Tex Avery, 1949) 80/3(1)/10/-48
Sans lendemain (Max Ophüls, 1940) 80/3/16/New
Red Hot Riding Hood (Tex Avery, 1943) 79/4/14/-55
Body and Soul (Robert Rossen, 1947) 78/3/19/New
Detour (Edgar Ulmer, 1945) 76/4/11/-49
The Song Lantern (Mikio Naruse, 1943) 75/2(1)/6/New
The More the Merrier (George Stevens, 1943) 75/2(1)/9/New
I Married a Witch (René Clair, 1942) 74/4/11/New
Gilda (Charles Vidor, 1946) 74/6/21/-12
Inspirace (Karel Zeman, 1949) 73/2(1)/3/New

Spring in a Small Town (Fei Mu, 1948) 73/3(1)/8/-93
Moonrise (Frank Borzage, 1948) 72/6/26/New
Unfaithfully Yours (Preston Sturges, 1948) 71/3(1)/6/-86
Hangmen Also Die! (Fritz Lang, 1943) 70/4/19/-8
Spring Awakens (Mikio Naruse, 1947) 69/3/19/New
It Always Rains on Sunday (Robert Hamer, 1947) 69/3/22(x2)/New
Utamaro and His Five Women (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1946) 69/4/21/-55
Act of Violence (Fred Zinnemann, 1948) 68/4/11/New
Ornamental Hairpin (Hiroshi Shimizu, 1941) 67/2/12/New
The 47 Ronin (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1941) 66/2(1)/2/-80

Le ciel est à vous (Jean Grémillon, 1944) 66/4/28/New
Children of the Beehive (Hiroshi Shimizu, 1948) 65/2(1)/7/New
Pattes blanches (Jean Grémillon, 1949) 65/3/11/-86
On the Town (Stanley Donen & Gene Kelly, 1949) 63/5/14/New
The Mortal Storm (Frank Borzage, 1940) 62/2(1)/3/-36
The Pride of the Yankees (Sam Wood, 1942) 62/2/12/New
The Devil and Miss Jones (Sam Wood, 1941) 62/3/13/New
Rope (Alfred Hitchcock, 1948) 62/5/27/-114
The Dover Boys at Pimento University or the Rivals of Roquefort Hall (Chuck Jones, 1942) 61/2(1)/10/New
Never Give a Sucker an Even Break (Edward Cline, 1941) 60/2(1)/4/New

Intruder in the Dust (Clarence Brown, 1949) 60/2/18/New
Kings Row (Sam Wood, 1942) 60/3/29/New
The Way to the Stars (Anthony Asquith, 1945) 59/2(1)/5/New
Colorado Territory (Raoul Walsh, 1949) 59/2/19/New
He Walked by Night (Alfred Werker & Anthony Mann, 1948) 58/2/15/New
Kiss of Death (Henry Hathaway, 1947) 57/2(1)/4/-92
Fireworks (Kenneth Anger, 1947) 57/3(1)/7/-108
Krakatit (Otakar Vávra , 1949) 57/2/22/New
Twelve O'Clock High (Henry King, 1949) 57/3/23/New
Crows and Sparrows (Zheng Junli, 1948) 56/2/19/New

María Candelaria (Emilio Fernández, 1943) 55/2(1)/4/New
No Regrets for Our Youth (Akira Kurosawa, 1946) 55/2(1)/6/New
Roxie Hart (William Wellman, 1942) 55/2(1)/7/New
Große Freiheit Nr. 7 (Helmut Käutner, 1944) 55/3/11/New
Drunken Angel (Akira Kurosawa, 1948) 55/4/23/-47
They Were Expendable (John Ford, 1945) 55/4/26/-28
The Lost Weekend (Billy Wilder, 1945) 54/3(1)/8/-37
This Land Is Mine (Jean Renoir, 1943) 54/2/17/New
King-Size Canary (Tex Avery, 1947) 54/3/20/-116
Riso amaro (Giuseppe de Santis, 1949) 53/2(1)/5/New

A Royal Scandal (Otto Preminger, 1945) 52/2/20/New
Under Capricorn (Alfred Hitchcock, 1949) 51/2/13/-88
Remorques (Jean Grémillon, 1940) 51/2/24/New
Mrs. Miniver (William Wyler, 1942) 49/3(1)/7/New
Macbeth (Orson Welles, 1948) 49/2/18/-68
It Happened at the Inn (Jacques Becker, 1943) 49/2/22/New
The Sea Hawk (Michael Curtiz, 1940) 49/3/29/New
Blood and Sand (Rouben Mamoulian, 1941) 48/3(1)/8/New
The Stranger (Orson Welles, 1946) 48/5/24/-70
Thieves' Highway (Jules Dassin, 1949) 48/7/40/-158

Criss Cross (Robert Siodmak, 1949) 47/2/20/-78
Foreign Correspondent (Alfred Hitchcock, 1940) 47/2/23/-91
The Window (Ted Tetzlaff, 1949) 47/3/26/New
Saboteur (Alfred Hitchcock, 1942) 46/2/20/New
Spellbound (Alfred Hitchcock, 1945) 45/2/22/-73
Oliver Twist (David Lean, 1948) 44/2/23/-99
Reign of Terror (Anthony Mann, 1949) 44/3/24/-64
Dreams That Money Can Buy (Hans Richter, 1947) 44/2/29(x2)/New
Jammin' the Blues (Gjon Mili, 1944) 43/3/21/-95
The Bank Dick (Edward Cline, 1940) 42/2/16/-73

Ride the Pink Horse (Robert Montgomery, 1947) 42/2/17/New
The Queen of Spades (Thorold Dickinson, 1949) 41/2/26/New
Daisy Kenyon (Otto Preminger, 1947) 39/2/21/New
Remember the Night (Mitchell Leisen, 1940) 37/2/32/New
A Letter to Three Wives (Joseph Mankiewicz, 1949) 36/2/25/New
Bluebeard (Edgar Ulmer, 1944) 36/2/27/New
The Way Ahead (Carol Reed, 1944) 36/2/29/New
Ziegfeld Follies (Vincente Minnelli et al, 1945) 35/3/30/New
The Little Foxes (William Wyler, 1941) 35/3/36/New
Yolanda and the Thief (Vincente Minnelli, 1945) 34/2/18/New

Gentleman Jim (Raoul Walsh, 1942) 31/2/22/New
Puce Moment (Kenneth Anger, 1949) 31/2/27/-83
Suspicion (Alfred Hitchcock, 1941) 31/2/29/-108
Native Land (Leo Hurwitz & Paul Strand, 1942) 31/2/29/New
The Razor's Edge (Edmund Goulding, 1946) 28/2/34/-86
We Were Strangers (John Huston, 1949) 28/2/37(x2)/New
Sergeant York (Howard Hawks, 1941) 27/2/27/New
Gaslight (Thorold Dickinson, 1940) 27/2/29/New
Arsenic and Old Lace (Frank Capra, 1944) 26/2/27/-60
The Naked City (Jules Dassin, 1948) 26/2/29/-143

Saraband for Dead Lovers (Basil Dearden, 1948) 26/2/33/New
The Spiral Staircase (Robert Siodmak, 1945) 23/3/38/New
The Snake Pit (Anatole Litvak, 1948) 23/3/40/New
L'Espoir (André Malraux & Boris Peskine, 1945) 22/2/30/New
The Postman Always Rings Twice (Tay Garnett, 1946) 22/2/36/New
The Sin of Harold Diddlebock (Preston Sturges, 1947) 22/2/37/New
Les Dames du Bois de Boulogne (Robert Bresson, 1945) 22/3/41/-186
Hellzapoppin' (H.C. Potter, 1941) 21/2/34/-91
The Upturned Glass (Lawrence Huntington, 1947) 21/2/37/New
Phantom Lady (Robert Siodmak, 1944) 21/3/38/-75

At Land (Maya Deren, 1944) 21/3/42/-159
Five Graves to Cairo (Billy Wilder, 1943) 20/2/38/New
Christ in Concrete (Edward Dmytryk, 1949) 20/2/38/-121
The Uninvited (Lewis Allen, 1944) 20/2/39/New
Manon (Henri-Georges Clouzot, 1949) 19/2/37/New
Nasty Quacks (Frank Tashlin, 1945) 14/2/39/New
Cobra Woman (Robert Siodmak, 1944) 9/2/46/New
Crossfire (Edward Dmytryk, 1947) 8/2/45/New
Shoeshine (Vittorio De Sica, 1946) 5/2/48/-161
Last edited by swo17 on Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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swo17
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#662 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:28 pm

Orphans

Adam's Rib (George Cukor, 1949) 31
Ala-Arriba! (José Leitão de Barros, 1942) 47
Along Sungari River (Jin Shen, 1947) 2
The Amazing Mr. X (Bernard Vorhaus, 1948) 8
Angels over Broadway (Ben Hecht & Lee Garmes, 1940) 40
Anna Karenina (Julien Duvivier, 1948) 30
Anni difficili (Luigi Zampa, 1948) 41
Antoine et Antoinette (Jacques Becker, 1947) 37
The Army (Keisuke Kinoshita, 1944) 34

The Ball at the Anjo House (Kôzaburô Yoshimura, 1947) 43
The Battle of San Pietro (John Huston, 1945) 28
The Battle of the Rails (René Clément, 1946) 14
Battleground (William Wellman, 1949) 43
Bedlam (Mark Robson, 1946) 15
The Bells Go Down (Basil Dearden, 1943) 36
Berlin Express (Jacques Tourneur, 1948) 37
Beyond the Forest (King Vidor, 1949) 21
The Big Steal (Don Siegel, 1949) 50
The Bishop's Wife (Henry Koster, 1947) 18
Blanche Fury (Marc Allégret, 1948) 30
Blood on the Moon (Robert Wise, 1948) 42
Border Incident (Anthony Mann, 1949) 45
The Bribe (Robert Leonard, 1949) 20
Brighton Rock (John Boulting, 1947) 29
A Broken Drum (Keisuke Kinoshita, 1949) 23
The Brothers and Sisters of the Toda Family (Yasujirô Ozu, 1941) 31

Cabin in the Sky (Vincente Minnelli, 1943) 17
Call Northside 777 (Henry Hathaway, 1948) 50
The Cat Concerto (William Hanna & Joseph Barbera, 1947) 10
Caught (Max Ophüls, 1949) 49
La Chartreuse de Parme (Christian-Jaque, 1948) 44
The Children Are Watching Us (Vittorio De Sica, 1944) 47
The Clock (Vincente Minnelli, 1945) 23
A Corny Concerto (Robert Clampett, 1943) 20
The Crystal Ball (Elliott Nugent, 1943) 39

Daffy Dilly (Chuck Jones, 1948) 45
The Damned (René Clément, 1947) 16
Deception (Irving Rapper, 1946) 35
The Devil Thumbs a Ride (Felix Feist, 1947) 47
The Devil's Mill (Jirí Trnka, 1949) 33
Dios se lo pague (Luis César Amadori, 1948) 49
Ditte menneskebarn (Bjarne Henning-Jensen, 1946) 19
Douce (Claude Autant-Lara, 1943) 43
Draftee Daffy (Robert Clampett, 1945) 34
Dragonwyck (Joseph Mankiewicz, 1946) 25
Duel in the Sun (King Vidor, 1946) 20

Easter Parade (Charles Walters, 1948) 39
Les Eaux troubles (Henri Calef, 1949) 49
L'Eternel Retour (Jean Delannoy, 1943) 27
The Eye & the Ear (Stefan & Franciszka Themerson, 1945) 48

Falbalas (Jacques Becker, 1945) 48
The Fan (Otto Preminger, 1949) 19
La Fille du puisatier (Marcel Pagnol, 1940) 32
Film Exercises 2 & 3 (James & John Whitney, 1944) 48
Film ohne Titel (Rudolf Jugert, 1948) 23
La Foire aux chimères (Pierre Chenal, 1946) 11

The Gay Parisian (Jean Negulesco, 1941) 25
The Ghost Ship (Mark Robson, 1943) 16
The Glass Key (Stuart Heisler, 1942) 14
Going My Way (Leo McCarey, 1944) 33
A Good Lad (Boris Barnet, 1943) 30
The Great McGinty (Preston Sturges, 1940) 33
The Great Piggy Bank Robbery (Robert Clampett, 1946) 30

Hair-Raising Hare (Chuck Jones, 1946) 14
Harmonia (Wojciech Has, 1948) 38
The Harvey Girls (George Sidney, 1946) 10
Henry V (Laurence Olivier, 1944) 22
Here Comes Mr. Jordan (Alexander Hall, 1941) 26
Das Herz der Königin (Carl Froelich, 1940) 25
Hideko, the Bus Conductor (Mikio Naruse, 1941) 8
Hollow Triumph (Steve Sekely, 1948) 12
Horton Hatches the Egg (Robert Clampett, 1942) 11

I Dood It (Vincente Minnelli, 1943) 50
I Wake Up Screaming (Bruce Humberstone, 1941) 33
I Walk Alone (Byron Haskin, 1948) 39
L'Idiot (Georges Lampin, 1946) 28
The Illegals (Meyer Levin, 1947) 15
Ima hitotabi no (Heinosuke Gosho, 1947) 36
In nome della legge (Pietro Germi, 1949) 33
Indonesia Calling (Joris Ivens, 1946) 34
The Iron Crown (Alessandro Blasetti, 1941) 37
It Had to Be You (Don Hartman & Rudolph Maté, 1947) 8
Ivy (Sam Wood, 1947) 36

Johnny Belinda (Jean Negulesco, 1948) 42
Jour de fête (Jacques Tati, 1949) 34
Juke Girl (Curtis Bernhardt, 1942) 48

Kashchei the Immortal (Aleksandr Rou, 1944) 19
Komödianten (G.W. Pabst, 1941) 42

Lady of Burlesque (William Wellman, 1943) 41
The Leopard Man (Jacques Tourneur, 1943) 33
The Letter (William Wyler, 1940) 46
Liebe '47 (Wolfgang Liebeneiner, 1949) 39
A Little Phantasy on a Nineteenth Century Painting (Norman McLaren, 1946) 40
The Locket (John Brahm, 1946) 49
The Lodger (John Brahm, 1944) 46
London Can Take It! (Humphrey Jennings & Harry Watt, 1940) 20
Long-Haired Hare (Chuck Jones, 1949) 3
Louisiana Story (Robert Flaherty, 1948) 44
Love Crazy (Jack Conway, 1941) 39
The Love of Sumako the Actress (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1947) 15
Love on the Dole (John Baxter, 1941) 17
Il lupo della Sila (Duilio Coletti, 1949) 29

La Main du diable (Maurice Tourneur, 1943) 42
Major Barbara (Gabriel Pascal, 1941) 49
Malombra (Mario Soldati, 1942) 33
Der Mann, dem man den Namen stahl (Wolfgang Staudte, 1944) 40
Mashenka (Yuli Raizman, 1942) 19
The Memphis Belle (William Wyler, 1944) 34
Men on the Mountain (István Szöts, 1942) 5
Mickey's Birthday Party (Riley Thomson, 1942) 30
Mr. and Mrs. Smith (Alfred Hitchcock, 1941) 3
Mr. Blandings Builds His Dream House (H.C. Potter, 1948) 37
Mr. Mouse Takes a Trip (Clyde Geronimi, 1940) 17
Mr. Skeffington (Vincent Sherman, 1944) 20
Miyamoto Musashi (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1944) 44
Mordprozeß Dr. Jordan (Erich Engels, 1949) 46
Murder, My Sweet (Edward Dmytryk, 1944) 46
My Love Has Been Burning (Kenji Mizoguchi, 1949) 12

Neecha Nagar (Chetan Anand, 1946) 28
The New Lot (Carol Reed, 1943) 40
The Next of Kin (Thorold Dickinson, 1942) 25
No Time for Love (Mitchell Leisen, 1943) 21
Northwest Passage (King Vidor, 1940) 47
La Nuit fantastique (Marcel L'Herbier, 1942) 49
Number 2: Message from the Sun (Harry Smith, 1941) 47

Objective, Burma! (Raoul Walsh, 1945) 39
Obsession (Edward Dmytryk, 1949) 35
Once More, My Darling (Robert Montgomery, 1949) 38
L'onorevole Angelina (Luigi Zampa, 1947) 25
La otra (Roberto Gavaldón, 1946) 46
Our Daily Bread (Slatan Dudow, 1949) 11
Outcry (Aldo Vergano, 1946) 40

Pacific 231 (Jean Mitry, 1949) 24
The Paradine Case (Alfred Hitchcock, 1947) 40
The Passionate Friends (David Lean, 1949) 50
Passport to Pimlico (Henry Cornelius, 1949) 18
Phoenix (Keisuke Kinoshita, 1947) 40
The Picture of Dorian Gray (Albert Lewin, 1945) 25
Pink String and Sealing Wax (Robert Hamer, 1945) 41
Princess O'Rourke (Norman Krasna, 1943) 41
Prison (Ingmar Bergman, 1949) 48
The Private Affairs of Bel Ami (Albert Lewin, 1947) 50
Puss n' Booty (Frank Tashlin, 1943) 31

The Quiet Duel (Akira Kurosawa, 1949) 27

Ramrod (André De Toth, 1947) 35
Random Harvest (Mervyn LeRoy, 1942) 33
Ruthless (Edgar Ulmer, 1948) 26

San Demetrio, London (Charles Frend, 1943) 30
Santa Fe Trail (Michael Curtiz, 1940) 35
The Scarlet Claw (Roy Neill, 1944) 26
Le Secret de Mayerling (Jean Delannoy, 1949) 16
Senza pietà (Alberto Lattuada, 1948) 23
Seven Journeys (Helmut Käutner, 1947) 43
The Seventh Veil (Compton Bennett, 1945) 18
The Silent Village (Humphrey Jennings, 1943) 46
Sleep, My Love (Douglas Sirk, 1948) 36
Somewhere in the Night (Joseph Mankiewicz, 1946) 17
The Song of Bernadette (Henry King, 1943) 10
Sortilèges (Christian-Jaque, 1945) 43
The Southerner (Jean Renoir, 1945) 27
The Spring River Flows East (Cai Chusheng & Zheng Junli, 1947) 38
"Sredni Vashtar" by Saki (David Bradley, 1940) 31
Strange Illusion (Edgar Ulmer, 1945) 10
Stranger on the Third Floor (Boris Ingster, 1940) 30
Straßenbekanntschaft (Peter Pewas, 1947) 38
The Suspect (Robert Siodmak, 1944) 44

La Tempestaire (Jean Epstein, 1947) 35
That Hamilton Woman (Alexander Korda, 1941) 39
They Died with Their Boots On (Raoul Walsh, 1941) 43
They Drive by Night (Raoul Walsh, 1940) 46
Thirst (Ingmar Bergman, 1949) 50
This Happy Breed (David Lean, 1944) 3
The Three Caballeros (Norman Ferguson, 1944) 35
Till We Meet Again (Frank Borzage, 1944) 16
To Each His Own (Mitchell Leisen, 1946) 26
Tobacco Road (John Ford, 1941) 22
Too Late for Tears (Byron Haskin, 1949) 39
Torment (Alf Sjöberg, 1944) 34
La torre de los siete jorobados (Edgar Neville, 1944) 18
Tragic Hunt (Giuseppe de Santis, 1947) 1
Travelling Actors (Mikio Naruse, 1940) 18
Tulsa (Stuart Heisler, 1949) 50
Two-Faced Woman (George Cukor, 1941) 47

Unconquered (Cecil DeMille, 1947) 7
Undercurrent (Vincente Minnelli, 1946) 45

The Village Teacher (Mark Donskoy, 1947) 26
Vivere in pace (Luigi Zampa, 1947) 40
Volpone (Maurice Tourneur, 1941) 42
Voyage surprise (Pierre Prévert, 1947) 26

The Way You Wanted Me (Teuvo Tulio, 1944) 50
Western Approaches (Pat Jackson, 1945) 32
The Westerner (William Wyler, 1940) 39
When Strangers Marry (William Castle, 1944) 40
Whisky Galore! (Alexander Mackendrick, 1949) 3
Wiener Mädeln (Willi Forst, 1949) 25
A Wild Hare (Tex Avery, 1940) 42
Wir machen Musik (Helmut Käutner, 1942) 36
Woody Woodpecker (Walter Lantz, 1941) 43
Words and Music (Norman Taurog, 1948) 49
Wozzeck (Georg Klaren, 1947) 17
Last edited by swo17 on Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#663 Post by matrixschmatrix » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:05 pm

Wow, I was not expecting The Great McGinty or Olivier's Henry V to wind up as my orphans. On the other hand, I didn't trouble to make a case for either, so I guess it's my own damn fault.

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#664 Post by lubitsch » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:09 pm

Erm ... something is wrong here. I submitted a list of rankings as indicated by the dots after each number. I had e.g. Wozzeck on 17th which means 34 points and Mordprozeß Dr. Jordan on 46th which means 5 points. They get here 17 and 46 points however which means you've reversed the complete point table in my list.

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#665 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:10 pm

I'm not displaying points for orphans, but the ranking they received. If people think it makes more sense the other way, I can change it.

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Gregory
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#666 Post by Gregory » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:26 pm

I somehow forgot to include for Best Years of Our Lives even though I know I thought of it a few times while putting my list together. Glad to see it did well even without my help.

Pretty huge drop for Christ in Concrete, which probably has to do with it being OOP now. I don't think it's one of the very top films of the decade but it deserves better.
One of my orphans is Beyond the Forest, which apparently has rights issues keeping Warner from releasing it. King Vidor made a poor showing in general on this list.

I'm surprised that Detour was a casualty from the previous '40s list, after seeing it do well in the Noir list project. I feel it's a great film, not just a great noir.

And Pursued dropped way down to almost-ran status, which surprised me, though I now see it didn't do as well as it should have on the Westerns genre list (ranking #47, and I can't complain about the results of the genre lists at all because I haven't participated in those).
Last edited by Gregory on Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#667 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:36 pm

Answer key to all of my hints, to give a feel for how much things change throughout tabulation:

The current top 10 doesn't have too many surprises...other than including two shorts, one of them only a point behind 1st place!
SpoilerShow
Begone Dull Care, Bad Luck Blackie
One film that nearly topped our prior list and another that barely cracked the top 100 have essentially switched places this time. Both are by the same director.
SpoilerShow
Red River, His Girl Friday
The highest riser from the prior list (currently up 116 spots) and the highest ranking film that didn't place last time (currently #13) have seven Oscars between them. One of them is not in the Criterion Collection.
SpoilerShow
Great Expectations, How Green Was My Valley
There are two ties right now, at #12 and #69, where both tied films are by the same director. In one case, they're both short films.
SpoilerShow
Red River/The Big Sleep, Meshes of the Afternoon/Ritual in Transfigured Time
One director currently has five films ranking within a 20 place window (three of these within five places of each other). Another director also has three films within a five place window. Both of these things are happening in the top 50.
SpoilerShow
Sturges, Rossellini

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#668 Post by colinr0380 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:52 pm

Great work swo, and thanks for giving all the answers to your riddles in spoiler tags! While it might be a shame to see Citizen Kane swap places with Late Spring to come out on top, it seems to make a kind of cosmic sense that it happens in the year of the Sight and Sound poll! I do like that Ozu's A Hen In The Wind just squeezed into the top 100 due to a three way tie though!

It was a shame to see Thieves' Highway fall so much - I should have put it higher on my list! And amazing to see Went The Day Well? rocketing up the charts - thanks to the Blu ray?

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#669 Post by thirtyframesasecond » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:53 pm

No real surprises with my list. The top 13 in the overall list all figured rather prominently in mine. Thereafter, there's a bit of a split between my list and the consensus. I'll discuss it more in the Sad Pandas thread.

Thanks for organising and compiling it swo17!

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#670 Post by matrixschmatrix » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:55 pm

colinr0380 wrote:Great work swo, and thanks for giving all the answers to your riddles in spoiler tags! While it might be a shame to see Citizen Kane swap places with Late Spring to come out on top, it seems to make a kind of cosmic sense that it happens in the year of the Sight and Sound poll! I do like that Ozu's A Hen In The Wind just squeezed into the top 100 due to a three way tie though!

It was a shame to see Thieves' Highway fall so much - I should have put it higher on my list! And amazing to see Went The Day Well? rocketing up the charts - thanks to the Blu ray?
Well, I voted for Thieves' Highway too, at least. I feel as though I'm personally responsible for every pick of mine that I didn't make a case for and wound up doing shittily- but at least my spotlight made the list!

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#671 Post by YnEoS » Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:07 pm

Can't believe They Live By Night got knocked off. Guess I can't complain too much though, since I didn't submit a list, but had I done that would've certainly been in my top 10.

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#672 Post by Tommaso » Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:14 pm

First of all, thanks a lot Swo, for all your hard work on this listmaking!

But now, if you allow me to say so, and I surely don't want to cause any bad blood: I find the result almost shockingly conventional, quite in contrast to the 20s and 30s list. I had thought that with the new technology called the internet many more films would come into focus that were unjustly neglected, but at least the Top100 feels like a rundown of good films easily available commercially in the US. Of course there are exceptions, and I'm happy that at least Staudte and Käutner made their entries in the lower ranks, but some extreme differences in the ranking of films that I personally find on somewhat the same level of importance irritate me. One example, with two films I did not vote for: is "The Third Man" so much better than "Shoeshine" that it gets 727 points, and the other only 5?

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#673 Post by swo17 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:27 pm

FWIW, note that films from the U.S. accounted for about 50% of total points in the '30s list, which was up to 60% in the '40s. (And if you add films from the UK, you get to about 75% coming from the English-speaking world--damn you, Archers!) Surely the war had a lot to do with this--notice the paucity of ranking foreign films during the first half of the decade.

My own personal list was only slightly over half American.
Last edited by swo17 on Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#674 Post by starmanof51 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:35 pm

Excellent work swo! As is often the case, the orphans and also-rans lists fascinate most.

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Tommaso
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Re: 1940s List Discussion and Suggestions

#675 Post by Tommaso » Mon Feb 27, 2012 3:49 pm

swo17 wrote:FWIW, note that films from the U.S. accounted for about 50% of total points in the '30s list, which was up to 60% in the '40s. (And if you add films from the UK, you get to about 75% coming from the English-speaking world--damn you, Archers!) Surely the war had a lot to do with this--notice the paucity of ranking foreign films during the first half of the decade.

My own personal list was only slightly over half American.
Yes, but did the war really mean that the films made in other countries than the US, even if the number of films made was going down, were so much inferior? I doubt that, as one of the great revelations I had when doing the watching for this list was the production of France, especially - and surprising for myself - under the occupation. Some great, great films there. I have the feeling that whole areas of production are still not being taken into proper consideration simply because these films were made under more than problematic political circumstances (putting it euphemistically). And that still doesn't explain the 5 points for "Shoeshine", made after the war and easily available from one of the most beloved labels of this forum.

Or take one of my favourites, Pewas' "Der verzauberte Tag", which thankfully at least made it into the also-rans. It received 80 points, and as I was the one who listed it as #8 (i.e. 42 points), the other voter must have placed it at #12. My question is: did everybody else who saw it not share the enthusiasm (which would be okay with me), or did the majority not feel the need to seek it out? Just an example that I mention because this film is so close to my heart.

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