MoviePass

Discuss films of the 21st century including current cinema, current filmmakers, and film festivals.
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Luke M
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Re: MoviePass

#101 Post by Luke M » Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:51 am

I guess it’s just me.

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jindianajonz
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Re: MoviePass

#102 Post by jindianajonz » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:32 pm

I just received the following email:
Thank you for choosing to switch to our $89.95 annual plan during our recent Limited Special Offer. Unfortunately, your request was not processed correctly.

We are sincerely sorry and we are taking steps to rectify your subscription as soon as possible.

We will send you an acknowledgement email once your subscription is in good order.
If you were billed $9.95 this month instead of, or in addition to the $89.95, you will be receiving a refund.

wattsup32
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Re: MoviePass

#103 Post by wattsup32 » Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:35 am

I got the same processing error email.

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Luke M
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Re: MoviePass

#104 Post by Luke M » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:40 am

I got the same email as well.

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Luke M
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Re: MoviePass

#105 Post by Luke M » Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:37 am

I got charged $80 this month and my subscription doesn’t expire for a year. Very happy they were able to fix it.


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Brian C
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Re: MoviePass

#107 Post by Brian C » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:20 am

Ouch, there goes the AMC River East here in Chicago. It's not like that will make my MoviePass a bad deal all the sudden, but it's a big blow, because they play a lot of films that are in limited release.

ETA: 15 of the 32 movies I've gone to see since I got my MoviePass were at the River East. Ugh. I know this is a first-world problem of an almost farcical level ... but still, it'll affect a big change in my movie-going habits one way or the other.
Last edited by Brian C on Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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mfunk9786
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Re: MoviePass

#108 Post by mfunk9786 » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:35 am

Feeling thankful that Regal has penetrated so much of my once AMC-dominated market

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Brian C
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Re: MoviePass

#109 Post by Brian C » Fri Jan 26, 2018 1:09 am

From the linked article:
AMC wrote:”MoviePass paid AMC, according to our records, $11.88 for each and every ticket that it purchased for our mutual guest. That’s quite a gap, $9.95 a month versus $11.88 a visit. I must point out that’s very gracious of them and we appreciate their business, but I think it’s also important to make clear that despite claims they’ve made to the contrary, AMC has absolutely no intention, I repeat no intention, of sharing any – I repeat, any, of our admissions revenue or our concessions revenue with MoviePass.”
I don't have an opinion on whether AMC should officially partner with MoviePass or not, but it does blow my mind that AMC constantly goes out of their way to be such total dicks. I mean, am I wrong, or is their tone here basically "Sure, they're driving a lot of business our way, and we're profiting handsomely from it, but seriously fuck those guys"?

Anyway, I'll get over it, but this does mean that three out of the probably five theatres I went to the most before I got my MoviePass (River East, ArcLight, Landmark Century Centre) don't accept it. Obviously the latter two of those never took it in the first place, and that's cool, but any more attrition and I'll really have to go out of my way to see most of what I want to see. If they stop serving the AMC 600 N Michigan - which seems extremely possible at the moment if not inevitable - I'll have to at least consider cancelling I think. I've seen 6 movies there, and nowhere else more than two.

neal
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Re: MoviePass

#110 Post by neal » Sun Jan 28, 2018 6:36 pm

My sense is that this was a shot across the bow from MoviePass. Essentially saying-- "hey, AMC... you don't want to play ball? We'll send all the business we've been sending to these high-traffic theaters to the Regal/Landmark/other theater across the street..."

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Ribs
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Re: MoviePass

#111 Post by Ribs » Sun Jan 28, 2018 10:47 pm

Yup, and MoviePass has basically weaponized their subscribers to automatically respond like this is in anyway not always what their plan was. AMC was working just fine without MoviePass - it will continue to work just fine without them. They would have to be complete dunderheads to cowtow to these demands, especially when AMC *wants* to back out of supporting MoviePass. It's always been an unsustainable model, now AMC just needs to stick by their gut to make sure it stays that way.

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Re: MoviePass

#112 Post by neal » Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:35 pm

Ribs wrote:AMC was working just fine without MoviePass - it will continue to work just fine without them.
I'm not sure that's true, though.

Q4 numbers haven't come out yet, but is appears that AMC lost money last year Over the summer, there were estimates of a likely net loss of $125 million to $150 million for the year last year. Now they're going to start losing patrons in big city (high ticket price) markets.

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Ribs
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Re: MoviePass

#113 Post by Ribs » Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:44 pm

Net loss is to be expected when you’re in the process of renovating 90% of your theaters

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McCrutchy
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Re: MoviePass

#114 Post by McCrutchy » Mon Jan 29, 2018 3:55 am

neal wrote:
Ribs wrote:AMC was working just fine without MoviePass - it will continue to work just fine without them.
I'm not sure that's true, though.

Q4 numbers haven't come out yet, but is appears that AMC lost money last year Over the summer, there were estimates of a likely net loss of $125 million to $150 million for the year last year. Now they're going to start losing patrons in big city (high ticket price) markets.
I'm not sure how working with a business that is very likely a bubble waiting to burst would be helpful to AMC. I will contend that the theater experience has gone way downhill since the switch to digital, but I'll admit, I have been on AMCs side about MoviePass thus far, and I've really never understood why any NATO member--certainly not the big chains--would accept the cards in the first place. If some service came along and offered to pay my credit cards off for $100 a month per card, on the proviso that I only purchase certain expensive things once a month, I'll bet Visa, MasterCard and American Express (to say nothing of my issuing bank), would be royally pissed off.

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mfunk9786
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Re: MoviePass

#115 Post by mfunk9786 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:17 am

neal wrote:
Ribs wrote:AMC was working just fine without MoviePass - it will continue to work just fine without them.
I'm not sure that's true, though.

Q4 numbers haven't come out yet, but is appears that AMC lost money last year Over the summer, there were estimates of a likely net loss of $125 million to $150 million for the year last year. Now they're going to start losing patrons in big city (high ticket price) markets.
I'd tend to agree with neal on this - if someone has the choice of going to an AMC and paying out of pocket, or going to another theater (talking MoviePass patrons here, of which there are more and more every day), that is absolutely going to cut into AMC's market share. Wouldn't have been the case a year ago, but now there's a good chunk of dedicated moviegoers who are using this service. I can only speak anecdotally to this, but I go to the Landmark theaters in Philadelphia far less since getting MoviePass than I did before. If they accepted MoviePass they'd be getting a lot more of "my" money.

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Ribs
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Re: MoviePass

#116 Post by Ribs » Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:32 am

AMC doesn’t need the two million subscribers to MoviePass altogether. MoviePass has shifted its economic strategy to something which results in literally any subscriber who uses their service monthly is putting them in the red; they’re undoubtedly losing millions each month and probably don’t have the capital to sustain that for very long.

The notion they want concession revenue is also total bullshit. The multiplexes worked fine - all MoviePass is doing is getting people to dislike then.

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mfunk9786
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Re: MoviePass

#117 Post by mfunk9786 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:41 am

Ribs wrote:AMC doesn’t need the two million subscribers to MoviePass altogether. MoviePass has shifted its economic strategy to something which results in literally any subscriber who uses their service monthly is putting them in the red; they’re undoubtedly losing millions each month and probably don’t have the capital to sustain that for very long.
MoviePass' bottom line has nothing to do with AMC's, though. If MoviePass is losing money, what difference does that make to AMC if that money MoviePass is losing doesn't go into their pockets the way it is with the other theater chains? You seem to be conflating your feelings on the long-term viability of MoviePass with the very real circumstance of millions of people using it to pay for their tickets, which is going to dictate where they decide to go see a movie if there is brand parity in their area. This is obviously a small piece of AMC's overall swath of theaters, but if they continue down this road, they could absolutely see substantial losses from this, whether you think MoviePass is a viable business model or not. As long as it's still around, theater chains are either going to have to accept the (full, MasterCard-backed) ticket money from MoviePass, or lose business. I'm glad you can be cavalier about it not mattering, but it absolutely does matter when a customer who'd otherwise hand you their money takes that money and puts it somewhere else - in any business.

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Ribs
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Re: MoviePass

#118 Post by Ribs » Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:53 am

But AMC doesn’t have a choice in the matter, because MoviePass has altered the terms of the deal! They’re trying to force AMC into a position where they *do* get subtantially less for tickets sold through the service, and also to gain a percentage of all sales (AMC will never go along with that part, and I expect they won’t for the other half, but I’m less confident). The theaters have the ticket prices set as they are for a reason - if MoviePass patrons have determined they don’t want theaters to get what they’re due good riddance to them.

ETA: If this were in any way sustainable at anything close to a competitive rate, AMC will institute their own subscription service soon enough. But while MoviePass is still undercutting the market by just giving movies away essentially for free theaters would probably need to have a cost more in the range of what MoviePass was before this utterly unnecessary change (probably variable by market?)
Last edited by Ribs on Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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McCrutchy
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Re: MoviePass

#119 Post by McCrutchy » Mon Jan 29, 2018 11:57 am

Well, as pointed out by The Verge, MoviePass is being very deceptive in its claims about how much money it is bringing in for AMC in the first place.

I get what they are trying to do, and in theory, I'm all for it, but I don't need another company getting access to my personal data, and if those numbers reported by The Verge are at all accurate, MoviePass is way out of order in demanding a 20% cut of concessions from AMC. It sure sounds like MoviePass' parent company are simply foaming at the mouth to get dozens of millions of people onboard and scrutinize their lives for money.

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Re: MoviePass

#120 Post by cdnchris » Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:01 pm

Wait, so is that ultimately what their business plan is? The theaters will pay them to let people use Movie Pass at their theaters?

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Ribs
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Re: MoviePass

#121 Post by Ribs » Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:06 pm

They're demanding for these ten or so theaters that have been shut out that they get a cut of all MoviePass sales (effectively, that MoviePass "pays" the theater less than the going ticket price) and they get a 20% cut of all concessions, which as McCrutchy suggested is totally crazy (like, even if it was a 1% cut I have a hard time imagining chains going along with it).

It's not a coincidence they're going after AMC, and not just suddenly imposing harsh restrictions on all their major urban theater partners; they don't want their user base to be upset that all the theaters get taken off the service, and create this competition with itself which is totally unnecessary, and if one of the majors does bow over in any way the other suddenly all become obligated to do it.

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mfunk9786
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Re: MoviePass

#122 Post by mfunk9786 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 1:07 pm

McCrutchy wrote:I don't need another company getting access to my personal data
...what movies you see? And your credit card number to pay for it? Beyond that, what other personal data is MoviePass getting that is valuable to you that other, much more intimidatingly omniscient companies don't already have?

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McCrutchy
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Re: MoviePass

#123 Post by McCrutchy » Mon Jan 29, 2018 2:00 pm

mfunk9786 wrote:
McCrutchy wrote:I don't need another company getting access to my personal data
...what movies you see? And your credit card number to pay for it? Beyond that, what other personal data is MoviePass getting that is valuable to you that other, much more intimidatingly omniscient companies don't already have?
That's not the point. Beyond the fact that MoviePass' (apparently ever-changing) terms and conditions probably allow for them to sell any of your data, like name, address, phone, and e-mail, to others, I suspect that the whole point of this program is to eventually figure out how to predict what people will watch, how often they will watch it, where they will go to watch it, and so on, and so forth. Over time, it adds up to a lot of information, and if MoviePass' card is also used to buy concessions--something I'm sure they want--then they will get even more data about what you are willing to pay to eat at a theater, how often you visit the concession stand when you go, and so on, and so forth.

Again, remember that MoviePass' parent company is a data analytics company, so mining seemingly innocuous data for patterns is what they are in business to do, and is the reason for MoviePass' very existence. And while these kinds of things can get creepily personalized, as Target proved about five years ago, for me it's just as much about the fact that seemingly everyone, from your doctor to your boss to your house of worship, not to mention each store you buy from and each place of business you visit, now wants to collect personal data. I hate text messaging, and I never use it, but now my doctor's office--unsolicited by me--sends me texts automatically. I'm even getting tired of giving people my e-mail address.

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knives
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Re: MoviePass

#124 Post by knives » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:42 pm

McCrutchy is technically correct, I recently heard a speech from the representative of one of their major banking investors speak and he said data was the main reason for investing in such a stupid sounding plan, but also so what?

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mfunk9786
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Re: MoviePass

#125 Post by mfunk9786 » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:45 pm

Perhaps I'll be paying the ultimate price if this turns out to have any effect on anything, but I'm okay with someone knowing how often I visit the concession stand if it means paying $10 a month to go to the movie theater as much as I want. There are times when data collection is a serious problem (when the data is something you would, say, want totally private and you don't know it's being collected), but jeez - I mean, I'll tell you what I'd like to eat at a movie theater if you really want

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