Lost

[John Cope]

Well, this pretty much sums up my own attitude at this point. Not to say it can't change. But it's going to require a lot.

[Murdoch]

I'll post more later but my biggest problem as of now - and it won't change - is that the characters we've been with the entire series are merely pawns, and that from what I can tell the whole Dharma initiative and the others and just about everything that came before these final episodes is now meaningless in the scheme of this pseudo-Cain and Abel dichotomy. Alright, so the whole meaninglessness of everything that came before may change if they show how Jacob/MiB is connected to what I mentioned, but the characters-as-pawns thing is pretty hard to change now.

[Matt]

I think this episode was necessary, but it should have been maybe the second or third episode of this season, not the (as Jason Mittell said) antepenultimate episode. If that were the case, people would be feeling a lot less ripped-off right now.

Haven't we always known (or suspected) that the characters were pawns of some higher power? It seems like season 2, the show has had the theme of what the island wants from people or the concept of "the island isn't done with you yet." Just because that concept now has a face, I don't think anything's really changed. The show's always pretty much been about faith vs. reason and destiny vs. free will (Locke vs. Jack, Jacob vs. Man in Black), and I think it's still too early to say the show's come down on one side or the other.

They should torture and fire the hell out of the marketing genius who came up with the idea of having a huge V logo and a clock during Lost.

But now that guy is my hero for inadvertently proving what a fraud Sun's aphasia would turn out to be.

[Polybius]

The Mt. Dew-underwear line was funny enough but the rest of that Ryan piece exemplifies everything that I hate about infotainment TV criticism.

[mfunk9786]

My issue with last week's episode (and this season as a whole) is just how arrogantly it took its grand ol' time. I mean, surely we can live without an entire hour of something that could have been explained in the first ten minutes of a Jacob/Man in Black mega-sode. When the creators say they simply don't have time to wrap up all the loose ends that made fans love the show in the first place, and then give us this episode, alt-verse plots involving Jack's son playing a piano recital, etc... one can't be blamed for being annoyed with how badly valuable self-inflicted time restraints are being ignored. What happened to the breakneck pace that this show used to have?

[Matt]

What happened to the breakneck pace that this show used to have?

I think it only ever had that intermittently. I remember comparing the start of Heroes, season 1 to the first 6-episode block of Lost, season 3 and being really impressed with how quickly Heroes moved its narrative along compared to Lost's comparatively glacial pace and seeming total unwillingness to answer any previously-raised questions. I think, apart from the first season, it wasn't until we got to season 4 when things really started to pick up again (and we switched to flash-forwards instead of flash-backs).

[dx23]

What happened to the breakneck pace that this show used to have?

I think it only ever had that intermittently. I remember comparing the start of Heroes, season 1 to the first 6-episode block of Lost, season 3 and being really impressed with how quickly Heroes moved its narrative along compared to Lost's comparatively glacial pace and seeming total unwillingness to answer any previously-raised questions. I think, apart from the first season, it wasn't until we got to season 4 when things really started to pick up again (and we switched to flash-forwards instead of flash-backs).

Agreed. Seasons 2 and 3 of Lost focused more on character development. That's why several episodes were just about Jack, Sawyer and Kate locked up in the Bear cells. It started to get more fast paced from season 4 on, and still, it wasn't as fast paced as the first season of Heroes, which sadly, was the only good one they had.

[terabin]

A nice article in Variety by Jorge Garcia featuring his thoughts on the show ending.

[Polybius]

I guess it was just too expensive and labor intensive to have Cuse & co. go around the world to ring the door of everyone who ever watched this show and kick them in the groin, so this will have to do.

[John Cope]

I don't know, man. I haven't wept that much and that hard over a TV show in as long as I can remember.

[Murdoch]

I liked it a lot, especially the final images of Jack on the island. The conclusion of the alternate reality was troubling, though, I'll have to think it over.

[John Cope]

The conclusion of the alternate reality was troubling, though, I'll have to think it over.

This was the thing that made it all work for me (in fact, I was totally on the fence until then). After years of dubious or outright misbegotten decision making the show utterly redeemed itself in those last ten minutes. Somehow, miraculously, it escaped the damning confines of what had become an unproductive, unmanageable and absurdly self-absorbed mythology; one which promised much initially but just became more and more distracted by its own superficial details.

Despite my own affection for Spielberg and the fact that I think his brand of melodrama can often be very successful, the emotional moments in Lost have often felt like the kind of shallow, easy manipulation for which Spielberg always gets unfairly condemened (unfair when it's undeserved; he has been known to deserve it). Actually, I was not thrilling to all the flash-reunion stuff anymore than I was buying into the plot arc on the island. Everything was solid enough but felt so pre-ordained, so calculated and expected. Still, what happened in the last ten minutes here made all the difference as it causes us to regard differently the very meaning of those reunion moments which had seemed so banal and obvious (and promised the equally banal "happy ending" I imagined the show had twisted itself in knots in order to provide). Also, the last ten minutes allowed all the convoluted (and yet never clear or deep enough) Jacob and MIB stuff to be utterly swept aside; subordinated, though, not made irrelevant. The point and purpose of the whole show felt clearly revealed for once, unhindered by the earlier dogmatic need for obfuscation. It was, finally and ultimately, absolutely devastating and, what's more, emotionally true.

[dx23]

I liked it. Still don't know why. Probably because my expectations were so low to begin with, but I really like the ending. They still didn't explain everything, but sometimes, things are left better that way.

[mfunk9786]

Why create this gorgeous, complicated and absolutely original mythology, just to kick it under the rug like you're embarrassed by it?

[Polybius]

So everybody can have a big ol' hug and go to Valhalla en masse.

[LQ]

I guess it was just too expensive and labor intensive to have Cuse & co. go around the world to ring the door of everyone who ever watched this show and kick them in the groin, so this will have to do.

I'm firmly in this camp. I really enjoyed most of Lost's run, but that series finale was more disappointing than I could've imagined, especially the last minutes. Rendering Lost's exquisite mythology and mystery totally inconsequential in such a conventional and saccharine final act was a slap in the face to me. I'll try to be magnanimous and say that I'm happy for those who found lovely and fitting closure in the series finale, because it seems (at least from my perspective) that the overwhelming majority was left tear-stained & content by that abomination of an ending.

[dx23]

I completely understand people who didn't like it. It's true, they didn't answer questions at all, not even about the biggest character, the Island. The mistake was that in the 6th season, writers should had been answering those, but instead the focus too much on the alternate timeline in order to connect that to the finale, instead of answering things like why was Walt special? How the Dharma got a hold of the Island? Why was the temple important? It's true that the ending didn't tie or relate to anything regarding some of the seasons storylines.

[Matt]

I was with it all the way (esp. the Sawyer and Juliet reunion) until the scenes in the church. Even though I hate it as a final resolution, I'm willing to accept that they're all...what?...souls outside of time hanging out in the church? But did any of the events in the flash-sideways timeline in all the previous 16 episodes actually "happen?" Was it all "purgatory?" If so, why didn't they remember about the island until they had their Dead Zone moment? It's not like I want answers to all the questions ever raised on the show, I just want the ending to make some sense in the framework of the story world.

Instead of ending up at the Unitarian Universalist church, why didn't they just end up back on the island all wearing white or something? That's the world they all knew together. Wouldn't all the 815 survivors being back on the island together, free of all the previously existing threats, be the ideal "heaven?" And then their spirits could all be the new Jacob, protecting the island.

Even though for this whole season I suspected the last shot of the show would be Jack's eye, I really kind of wanted everybody to get together in the flash-sideways world, somehow magically be transported to the island (a wizard did it), and Sawyer to look around at everybody and say, "Son of a bitch." Cut to title.

[Murdoch]

What I liked most about the finale is its emphasis on the characters. I was afraid that with the emerging dominance of the Jacob-MiB plot that the writers would simply shift away from the characters that we'd come this whole way with in order to answer questions about Jacob/MIB and sacrifice character for resolution. While I know I'm in the minority I'm glad they chose to nix providing explanations in favor of giving their characters some type of resolution because as I've read on a few forums the explanations can be provided by anybody, and I never had much interest in getting answers to begin with. I watched the show simply because I found the characters so endearing and wanted to see what would happen to them, for me any answers weren't going to make me more or less interested as long as Jack, Kate, et. al. got their due.

[Cde.]

Basically, Lost is Titanic.

[Matt]

Rick Paulas makes some sense of the finale (and the whole series), as best he can.

[Polybius]

Even though for this whole season I suspected the last shot of the show would be Jack's eye, I really kind of wanted everybody to get together in the flash-sideways world, somehow magically be transported to the island (a wizard did it), and Sawyer to look around at everybody and say, "Son of a bitch." Cut to title.

I love it. As far as I'm concerned, this was the real ending.

[mfunk9786]

I've essentially thought about nothing but Lost for the last few weeks now, and I figured I'd put my thoughts down so they hopefully fly out of my head like black smoke out of a pool of golden evil whatzit soup.

I never realized it until the finale, bu there really are two different types of fans of this show. As I was catching up on it and becoming more and more amazed and perplexed by the mythology of it, there were people who were completely wrapped up in the characters and relationships of it. I'm no sci-fi fan for the most part, but I suppose something as vast as Lost sort of forced my hand (When you first hear the radio transmission upon their arrival on the island, how can you resist your imagination having an orgasm? It wouldn't be normal not to freak out and get excited for what wonders the show has in store.)

It seems like the creators of the show had quickly fallen in love with their characters, however, and used all the weirdo mythology and bizarre occurrences on the island as a conduit for very personal stories about these people, and expected viewers of the show to not care as much about the mythology by the end of the show as they do about the characters. Unfortunately, to me, the characters were never the draw - there are obviously some very likeable ones, and unlikeable ones, and there are heartwrenching, beautiful moments (see: the end of "The Constant"). But at the end of the day, the characters on the show are archetypes and are more than a little lacking in unique perplexity, and this becomes less as the show goes on, but one still can't help but remember that "oh, Sawyer has a chip on his shoulder because of ______, and Jack is stubborn and skeptical, and Locke is having his faith tested and is rediscovering himself", etc etc. These aren't things we haven't seen before in countless television shows, films, books, and so on.

So the finale didn't appeal to me, because the characters aren't what sucked me into the show and aren't what I needed closure on. I really hope the characters are very happy and I'd be glad to send them warm feelings of congratulations for finding peace, but that's not what runs through your mind as the show progresses - I wanted closure on the most interesting character on the show - The Island. What an amazing, multifaceted idea it is, that Island - and it was clear that the creators were just using it as a MacGuffin for telling these personal stories. And that's fine and all, but it's not like it was a suitcase full of something glowing or videotapes being sent to someone's house. It was an unbelievably deep and rich locale for the entire show, a place that held heaps of mysteries - and six seasons of a television show should have been enough time to focus in more on those mysteries than the show decided to. I think the entire sixth season was a failure because the writers essentially gave up on trying to flesh out the Island, and they were trying to rely on people's nostalgia over these characters (oh, look who just popped up in the alternate universe!) - and it worked for a lot of fans, but I guess the fact that I caught up on the whole show in a matter of a few months didn't help me, because I came from a perspective of "yeah, yeah - I know all these people, just get back to the good stuff!".

Out of frustration after the finale I put my Blu-Rays of the show on eBay, thinking I'd never revisit it, but as time goes on, I think I'll use the money I make from them to buy the complete series set when it's released. I want to experience the mystery and the excitement again now that I've calmed down about the finale not being geared towards my sensibilities. I mean, hey, at least it was geared towards some fans' sensibilities, which is more that can be said for some hopeless TV finales. This is still most likely going to go down in history as the best television show of this decade, and one of the best ever, and I still think that distinction is justified.

[mfunk9786]

Here's the highest resolution image available of the upcoming Complete Collection boxset, which, judging from the looks of it, could either be really fucking cool or a total mess:

[Matt]

The design is awfully heavy on the island mythology for a show that was "character-driven." Wonder why they opted not to design it like a white church full of people hugging.