Alexander Kluge

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foggy eyes
Joined: Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:58 am
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#26 Post by foggy eyes » Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:11 pm

zedz wrote:Last installment!
End of an era.

Thanks for this mammoth series of posts, zedz - when I finally get around to working through the EF discs (well, the film work at least), I'll be stopping by this thread again and again. A great resource.

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zedz
Joined: Sun Nov 07, 2004 7:24 pm

Re: Alexander Kluge

#27 Post by zedz » Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:44 pm

foggy eyes wrote:
zedz wrote:Last installment!
End of an era.
Is 14 consecutive posts by one person in a thread a record? (Better add the caveat 'over the course of a month' before some hyperactive rival swan dives to glory)

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denti alligator
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#28 Post by denti alligator » Thu Apr 30, 2009 7:14 pm

Yes, zedz, thanks for these posts!

I can't wait to get the set.

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Lemmy Caution
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#29 Post by Lemmy Caution » Thu Apr 30, 2009 11:19 pm

I recently picked up two more of the Kluge Filmmuseum sets, so the thorough zedzing is much appreciated.

Of course, we're all going to have to go back to re-read and re-assess the whole series of posts when it comes out that zedz really is Alexander Kluge.
Last edited by Lemmy Caution on Fri May 01, 2009 11:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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zedz
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#30 Post by zedz » Fri May 01, 2009 10:40 pm

Lemmy Caution wrote:Of course, we're all going to have to go back to re-read and re-assess the whole series of posts when it comes out that zedz really is Alexander Kluge.
If I had Kluge's time management skills I'm sure maintaining two separate identities on opposite sides of the world would be a breeze.

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denti alligator
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#31 Post by denti alligator » Sun May 10, 2009 11:12 am

Zedz, did you notice that you have effectively been given the honor of being listed as a "reviewer" at the Edition Filmmuseum page for the Kluge set.

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zedz
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#32 Post by zedz » Sun May 10, 2009 6:45 pm

denti alligator wrote:Zedz, did you notice that you have effectively been given the honor of being listed as a "reviewer" at the Edition Filmmuseum page for the Kluge set.
Hah! I guess beggars can't be choosers. (And I suppose Franziska at the Filmmuseum knows who I am now - hi, Franziska!)

Pullquote: "Three opposable thumbs up!"

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Lemmy Caution
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#33 Post by Lemmy Caution » Mon May 11, 2009 5:23 am

Z, you certainly could get your Kluge reviews published somewhere if you added an intro and edited your reviews down a bit. Glory, prestige, maybe a little pocket change ... or might set yourself up to get free review copies from the Filmmuseum in future.

accatone
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#34 Post by accatone » Tue May 12, 2009 8:43 am

From the weekly newspaper Die Zeit - "What are you working on at the moment?" http://www.zeit.de/2009/19/Tag-der-Arbeit-Kluge" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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sevenarts
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#35 Post by sevenarts » Fri May 22, 2009 2:09 pm

So I've recently acquired the big Kluge box set as well, and following zedz's lead, I'm commencing a project to review my way through this massive oeuvre. I'll be posting updates regularly at my blog. The first two posts are up now: about Yesterday Girl and the early shorts he made prior to that.

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Camera Obscura
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#36 Post by Camera Obscura » Sat May 23, 2009 3:10 am

That's great. Keep writing! Seems there's gonna be a whole discourse about Kluge in the foreseeable future thanks to this mammoth Kluge-box. As for myself, I've only seen ten of his films (and hardly anything of his shorts and television work), but I'll happily leap up anything about Kluge.

I also noticed Facets is churning out one Kluge title after another during the past few months.

TIVOLI
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#37 Post by TIVOLI » Sat May 23, 2009 1:46 pm

The problem is that Facets has been advertising a number of Kluge DVDs since last year,
but as far as I know, nothing has been released by them . Their website is undergoing maintenance, so it is not a source for updated information. This may be yet another perverse habit of Facets, to entice us with promises that never come to fruition.

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Camera Obscura
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#38 Post by Camera Obscura » Sat May 23, 2009 6:44 pm

You're absolutely right. I didn't look carefully (since I have no intention of buying them anyway). Suddenly these titles turned up on Amazon, with a cover and release date, but I didn't notice they weren't available.

How on earth did they end up at Facets anyway? I guess it's better than nothing to get a little more exposure, but I think it will do more harm than good.

accatone
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#39 Post by accatone » Thu May 28, 2009 8:25 am

Essential link to Kluges Themenpark. (That should be added to the starting post of this thread.)

Further infos can be found in this interview from the daily newspaper Sueddeutsche.

Asked about the general idea of the Themenpark (Themen = topic or theme // Park = park) Kluge says that this is "(…) the idea of (the) garden, the necessity for parks - which is a beautiful habit of mankind, from the gardens of Semiramis to the Central Park in New York." Later in that interview he refers to Godards Histoire(s) du cinéma: "What Godard does for example in the "Histoire(s) du cinéma" - that he now regards the whole cinema as a partitur as if he was Ovid, presenting it in its metamorphose in which he connects the minor matters. That is what you can do when building a garden…" The interviewer: "Whereas Godard still is a lonely and solitary gardener…". Kluge replies: "Too bad that he is such a loner, i would have loved to be his acolyte, offered him this opportunity many times. He is like the spinstress Arachne, who his weaving history in her cloth (…)"

ps: of course this is just a short and quick translation from myself ... so beware!

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Camera Obscura
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#40 Post by Camera Obscura » Wed Jul 15, 2009 6:25 pm

zedz wrote:
That Reformzirkus show has to be seen to be believed. Kluge appears alongside an earnest TV host, an earnest trade unionist and an earnest film critic to discuss the merits of Artists under the Big Top after (presumably) its first television screening. The topic is ‘Film and Society’ and the discussion is framed wholly in what-about-the-workers platitudes against which a work as whimsical as that film could not hope to prevail. To give you a hint as to how hopeless Kluge’s situation is, it’s pointed out several times that aesthetics have no place in this discussion of ‘film’. Kluge manages to wrestle the discussion around to a consideration of the role of television in society, and specifically the way in which it constrains debate and the articulation of ideas by imposing rigid forms on discourse (as we’ve seen here). At this point, three-quarters of an hour in, the television show’s editor, completely pissed off that Kluge has ‘violated’ the bounds of discussion he’d hoped his guests would follow, intervenes, calling ‘cut’ and walking on stage to denounce Kluge (who quite sensibly points out that he shouldn’t invite people onto a discussion show if he didn’t want to hear what they have to say). The tirade runs and runs, and so does one of the cameras, and eventually this showdown turns into the show itself. By the hour and a half mark, the crew have emerged from the darkness and joined the debate and they take a vote as to whether the entire programme should be canned, screened only in part, or screened in its entirety, tantrums, breakdowns and all (it’s unanimously for the latter). But here you start to suspect that the programme’s editor, and maybe the crew, have engineered this ‘intervention’ simply to try and disprove by example Kluge’s earlier assertions about the constrained formats of television discourse (in fact, you half wonder whether this might be another of Kluge’s subversions of documentary forms). Kluge seems to be alert to this possibility and notes that this single example proves nothing about television as a mode of discourse, and even in this anarchic example, the discussion is still being mediated and contained by the host and editor of the show. The whole thing, running for more than two hours, is quite a spectacle, and though it sheds little light on Artists under the Big Top, or Kluge’s film practice at the time, it’s fascinating given his later move into television as his preferred mode of expression.
Yes, this was quite a spectacle. Actually, I wasn't really paying attention when the introductory statement about what was about to happen in the actual program was made, so I was actually quite surprised when all the turmoil started somewhere at the 43 minute mark. So much so, that it wasn't exactly clear to me who these people breaking into the discussion actually were. At first, I gathered they were simply part of the audience.

It's also quite interesting how some of the crew members seem so confident, and somewhat naive, about the role television might fulfil in educating the masses and the assumption that television is some sort of an 'honest medium' in which manipulation has no place (in the sense that it's possible one can make unbiased television of sorts), especially when they discuss what to do with the whole program after the turmoil started at roughly the 45 minute mark (canning it, screening it partly, screening it whole). This noble role television might play, still blissfully free from the competition of commercial television is, of course, very understandable in 1970, but still. If everything would be as conveniently arranged as the German media landscape of 1970, with two or three TV-channels, some radio stations and a couple of films here and there, that might function as an ideal tool for channelling and educating the masses, this very assumption would still hold some ground. Naturally, most of the arguments have lost some of its relevance in today's media landscape, but as an interesting time capsule, it's still fascinating and stimulating viewing.

And there's the resounding obsession with class (this is 1970, after all, every few minutes someone refers to class, and God forbid you were labled an enemy of the working class), that simply ceased to play any significant role in today's discourse. If one would say 'reaching the masses' was a relevant issue back then, 'reaching target groups' is the sole issue right now, basically the complete opposite. When, after the initial turmoil, the discussion calmed down a bit, and continues in civilized fashion, Kluge has to defend himself against the tiresome dictum (I'm radically over-simplifying) 'if the working class can't grasp it, it's ultimately worthless', which, according to Kluge, merely leads to simplified and banal statements (I'm paraphrasing). Of course, he wasn't the only one questioning this line of thinking, but certainly not a fashionable idea among German intellectuals in 1970. I seem to recall that in later years, Kluge (not in this program) was accused of being some kind of right-wing reactionary, which seems preposterous right now. Kluge's somewhat insular position in intellectual circles (partly by choice) does remind me of a similar affair with German writer Martin Walser, who, in the eighties was accused of right wing nationalist sympathies, simply because he stated that he longed for the Elbe and the towers of Dresden, and he could never get used to the partition of Germany. I may be wrong, but it wouldn't surprise me if Die Patriotin (1979) suffered similar reactions.

Somewhat saddening that these kind of in-depth two hour discussions on German, British, French and Dutch television (the only television landscapes I'm somewhat familiar with), seem to have almost disappeared from the eighties onwards. I think the only thing on German television that comes close now (that I'm aware of) is "Im Glashaus - Das philosophische Quartett", but I think this airs like four or six times a year, and is usually only an hour long.

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gokinsmen
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#41 Post by gokinsmen » Fri Jul 17, 2009 5:42 pm

zedz wrote:Yesterday Girl is full of memorable bits and pieces, but there’s a particular sequence in the middle of the film that’s gob-smacking in its audacity and irreverence and might give you an idea of what you’re in for. In the course of about three minutes, we get the following shots, in sequence:
For me, this sequence was the one misstep in an otherwise extraordinary film (for the reasons you already touched upon) and a colossal one to me. In fact, I would actually prefer Yesterday Girl to Vivre Sa Vie if not for that unnecessary, studied bit of pranksterism. Like something out of Chytilova's Daisies...ugh.

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Lemmy Caution
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#42 Post by Lemmy Caution » Mon Oct 05, 2009 4:32 am

I first started watching Kluge with the two odd low-budget sci-fi films, Willi Tobler and The Big Mess. After that, I was gobsmacked by the wacky inventive Anita G. Just watched Part-Time Work of A Domestic Slave, which like Anita G has Alexandra Kluge at the center of the film. Her presence really holds the film together. She always seems to have nervous energy, a new scheme, new potential for something to go wrong. Her compulsiveness makes her compulsively watchable.

The well-known Kluge scholar, Zedz, has a nice thorough post on the film, so I'll just add a few extra thoughts.

I liked the way that the assistant goes from being an abortion assistant to a labor activist assistant, as though the force of Roswitha's obsession/determination just carries her along. And just as soon as I was noting this and chuckling at this absurd but not unlikely scenario, the assistant lashes out and complains that her family is suffering and their endeavors are worthless. And of course her family tensions mirror those that Roswitha is trying to paper over (with leaflets, no doubt).

It's pretty uncanny how this 1973 film manages to deal with two issues so widely debated today (especially in the US) -- abortion and globalized outsourcing. It is interesting how Kluge wades into these hot-button socio-political issues, and yet his views are largely obscured, as he mostly focuses on the practical concerns of his quirky determined protagonist -- trying to make a living, providing for the family, and righting perceived wrongs. The abortion footage, despite or maybe even because of its documentary detachment, was unsettling and knocked me back on my heels for a few minutes.

The parallel structure that Kluge uses in the two halves of the film, to show Roswitha's two occupations/phases, adds an interesting layer to the film. Her abortion work is completely apolitical, merely part-time work designed to take care of her family, while her more full-time political labor agitation leads to her neglecting her family and undermining her husband's employment. In both stages, she fails to integrate the personal and the political in any satisfying or sustainable form. Which leads to the quirky comic ending, where her attempt to fuse family concerns and social justice comes off as charmingly, yet disturbingly, misguided.

accatone
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#43 Post by accatone » Wed Nov 25, 2009 9:32 am

These new DVD projects are essential and quite unique in that there are several/in fact many differnt and very interesting pieces under one conceptional "topic". This is how television could look - as some geman newspaper reporter said. I even prefer the new Früchte des Vertrauens to the Nachrichten aus der ideologischen Antike. There are no subtitles. And there still is the ugly/tautoligical typography . . . but well...
http://www.suhrkamp.de/buecher/fruechte ... 13515.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.suhrkamp.de/buecher/nachrich ... 13501.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

accatone
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#44 Post by accatone » Fri Nov 05, 2010 1:27 pm

Great skype (yes) interview between Kluge and Der Freitag (german weekly newspaper). Very interesting, very long - no subtitles. http://www.dctp.tv/#/meinungsmacher/aus" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ... -gegenwart
This is no direct link - you have to click the window "Ausweg aus der Gegenwart".

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knives
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#45 Post by knives » Fri Mar 11, 2011 3:09 am

Is there a place that is cheaper than the film museum website to buy the boxset?


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zedz
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#47 Post by zedz » Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:12 pm

Yes, these discs present recent television works that are not included in the Filmmuseum edition. However, I don't believe these discs include English subtitles, and unless you're extremely fluent in German you're probably wasting your time with Kluge's linguistically dense TV work, which tends to have a high talking-heads component.

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knives
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#48 Post by knives » Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:43 pm

Darn on the english subs (I'm a novice at best with the language). I would love for anyone to transport those films into an english friendly set.

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zedz
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#49 Post by zedz » Thu Sep 08, 2011 12:50 am

I think we'll both be holding our breath a very long time. Hardly any of Kluge's film work has been released in English territories, and the television work is vastly more obscure and niche-y. Which makes the missed opportunity of these Suhrkamp releases all the more frustrating, as it seems they've been very diligent in creating definitive editions of important obscure works, but have limited themselves to a (presumably tiny) domestic market rather than embrace a (slightly less tiny) international one.

accatone
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Re: Alexander Kluge

#50 Post by accatone » Thu Sep 08, 2011 4:01 am

zedz wrote:However, I don't believe these discs include English subtitles…
There are no subtitles for this one and none on all the other Suhrkamp discs as far as i can tell. Maybe this film could be described as a continuance to his first Suhrkamp release Nachrichten aus der ideologischen Antike. For everyone interested in AKs TV work one can only suggest to check out the great DCTP site first. It consists of many many themes & topics that are presented through different videoworks, interviews etcetera.. Its quite similar to the DVD mentioned above but with interactivity. For example today you can check out the topic of 09/11 http://www.dctp.tv/#/der-anschlag-auf-d ... ster-hand/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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