Fuck The Deaf

[Narshty]

It may just be coincidence, but starting with Dazed and Confused, Criterion seem to be dropping subtitles from their English-language releases. There's certainly zero mention of them on any upcoming releases. Aside from our hearing-impaired friends. I imagine subtitles will come in handy for a great many of the folk watching, say, A Canterbury Tale with its regional accents. Seems unnecessarily penny-pinching, especially when it's a measure that genuinely assists a sizeable portion of their customers. It wouldn't surprise me to learn they've taken the wheelchair ramps out of their offices too.

[Keaton]

say, A Canterbury Tale with its regional accents. .

Yes, I remember this one very hard to understand at times and the exclusion of sub's makes the release far less exiting.

Regards,

Dennis

[cdnchris]

Yeah, fuck em.

Actually, this was a practice they did before in their earlier releases. Most of their English language features didn't have them. I figured it was because they were new to the DVD format, coming from laser, and didn't really see the benefit. Now I'm just puzzled.

Is it really that much of a cost saving measure? I hope they don't continue this. I finally understood large chunks of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas I didn't before because of them, and I would have been fucked during Ratcatcher (and those subs were cool because, if I recall correctly, they translated "fags" to "cigarettes" in the subs and more stuff along those lines.)

[Narshty]

I found the Ratcatcher subs patronising in the extreme ("aye", a lovely word, became "yeah" for example, as if it wasn't blindingly obvious from the context).

Criterion are going absolutely bananas at the moment. They're seemingly going out of their way to strategically piss off different sections of their customers one at a time with "new and improved" strategies like windowboxing and the removal of the subs.

[cdnchris]

I found the Ratcatcher subs patronising in the extreme ("aye", a lovely word, became "yeah" for example, as if it wasn't blindingly obvious from the context).

Criterion are going absolutely bananas at the moment. They're seemingly going out of their way to strategically piss off different sections of their customers one at a time with "new and improved" strategies like windowboxing and the removal of the subs.

You're right about the Ratcatcher subs being patronizing (and I thought Canadians spelt everything the same) because yeah, I know what "aye" and "fag" means, but the fact they actually went the extra step still impressed me, because, hey, maybe somebody doesn't understand what "fag" means and will take it the wrong way. I still liked that.

Their new moves don't make much sense, and this one seems to be the weirdest. I can't see them really making more profit by losing them. Do they have new execs or something?

[Matt]

Are the discs Closed Captioned instead?

[Frank M]

English is not my first language, so I need subtitles to understand all of the dialogue. If they drop english subtitles from all future english-language releases they will probably lose many foreign customers.

[tavernier]

English is not my first language, so I need subtitles to understand all of the dialogue. If they drop english subtitles from all future english-language releases they will probably lose many foreign customers.

So in other words....Fuck the Foreigners! (A Bush-Cheney production)

[The Invunche]

Are the discs Closed Captioned instead?

Wont help non US Criterion buyers. CC is an American TV standard.

[Antoine Doinel]

Is it possible the studios who license the films to Criterion have asked them to stop using subtitle tracks so they can still release the films in non-R1 territories? Yes, I realize not everyone in R1 land speaks English as a first language, but it could be a way that studios are trying to siphon Criterion sales in foreign territories.

[Narshty]

Not even remotely likely, I'm afraid. Since about 1999, every single one of their discs have had subtitles in some capacity. Criterion insist on all their foreign language films having optional subtitles as part of the licensing agreement (much like our own beloved MoC). It doesn't make much sense that a company would ask Criterion not to put English subtitles on an English language film to prevent foreign sales, especially the likes of Universal who've had no problem with it before.

[Antoine Doinel]

It seems Criteriondvd.com is listing Dazed & Confused as having subtitles. Maybe Criterion just isn't listing them as a Special Feature any more?

http://www.criteriondvd.com/item_info.php?item_id=398

[cdnchris]

I remember the Beav said there weren't any, which I'm assuming means they actually tried to view subtitles.

[Ted Todorov]

Are the discs Closed Captioned instead?

Wont help non US Criterion buyers. CC is an American TV standard.

Not to mention American buyers with projectors and assorted other video equipment that doesn't support CCs.

Speaking of subs, I'm in France this week and it is killing me how few newer DVD releases have English subtitles, and not that many more French language DVDs have French subs either...

I just don't get the logic -- and if anything the problem is getting worse -- when the first batch of French DVDs that I was really exited about (like 6 years ago), namely MK2's first Truffaut box had English subs on everything including the extras. I foolishly thought it was a trend. Now, the Malle DVDs, the latest treasure coming from R2 France, don't even have French subs on them. Sure, Criterion is doing them, but how many years will I have to wait for a film I love like May Fools to come out -- I picked up the French DVD and I won't be able to share it with most of my friends...

Meanwhile, 6 years later, Criterion still hasn't gotten around to most of what was in that first Truffaut Box -- it will be a long wait for those of us who need subs for some of the Malle and Rivette movies that are out right now in France subless.

I just don't get the business aspect of this -- wouldn't they make MORE money by selling the DVDs themselves, as they would if they included subs, rather than getting a small percentage if the license them to someone else???

[otis]

This is also true for the majority of British DVDs (with notable exceptions like masterful Masters of Cinema, of course). Loads of films I'd love to turn foreign friends on to but can't cos there are no subs. I wish all films, including foreign editions, came with subs in the original language. I'm by no means fluent in various languages, but would still like to watch them reading the original dialogue, and falling back on an English translation (with all the simplifications and compromises any translation entails) only when necessary.

Fuck students of foreign languages!

[HerrSchreck]

I sorta wished they had subbed the Japanese stretches of TOKYO GA. I understand that Wenders, after long stretches of straight unsubbed Japanese (and I mean long) pipes in with his elucidation of the 'essence' of what it was his subjects statements were. But I really would have appreciated subtitles. I would really love to know precisely what is being said by his cameraman as he is going into great detail viz setting up shots, mounting the custom tripod, his breakdown into sincerest tears, etc. I found that frustrating.

The new WAGES OF FEAR subtitles only the non-english dialog. Stuff in English you better have good ears. Same goes for all of Monterey, for which there are interviews, etc. So this wouldn't be the first time. Someone mentioning the idea that the primary rightsholders are requesting this so that they may release their own Eng lang versions elsewhere-- that's just cuckoo reasoning. If the fricking thing is in English anyhow, I don't see how withholding or adding English only subtitles is going to open up or valve-off a market. I just think it's budgetary.

CC is going thru a strange period.

[godardslave]

is subbing expensive?

i really dont understand the logic of not subbing either.

[HerrSchreck]

Well somebody's gotta sit down paid by the hour I guess, map out the dialog & break it out into display-timing blocs, and find a way to get the meat & potatoes onscreen in stretches of rapid speech & fat monologs in particular. Then someone has to type it in & encode it. Unless it's a staff person on salary (I suppose someone could rifle about thru all their booklets & see if it's all the same person for English subbing... foreign languages obviously require translators variegated). If there was a staff person for english & they truly are cutting this extra then that's just lousy business & a bit rude actually.

[peerpee]

Subbing is really quite a difficult job to do properly -- and it's tedious. It can add about 6 weeks to a project, and be costly. If the same person is doing this job every day, then it's likely they'll want to move on to another job pretty soon....

[Cinesimilitude]

I'd do it for the english films, I sub my own stuff all the time.

Hear me criterion? I'm willing...

PS. Will cost you a copy of the entire collection, including OOP's, and all future releases.

[Narshty]

It seems Criteriondvd.com is listing Dazed & Confused as having subtitles. Maybe Criterion just isn't listing them as a Special Feature any more?

Criteriondvd.com is useless for accurate technical specs. They've been confidently claiming for over a year now that every release is single-layer, simply because Criterion dropped the "RSDL: Optimal Image Quality" line from the back of the case. To my knowledge, all releases since mid-2003 have been dual-layer.

[Gordon]

Fuck The Deaf

Well... [hems and haws] alright. Does it have to be a man or a woman? Do they bite? How long do they usually take to come? Do I need extra insurance? Will it effect me karma in a positive way?

[mezcla]

i'd do spanish subs if they would get around to doing any more spanish language films. it only took them 8 years to release Viridiana. at that rate i could translate about 10 minutes a week and than take 7 1/2 years off.

[Antoine Doinel]

Well somebody's gotta sit down paid by the hour I guess, map out the dialog & break it out into display-timing blocs, and find a way to get the meat & potatoes onscreen in stretches of rapid speech & fat monologs in particular. Then someone has to type it in & encode it. Unless it's a staff person on salary (I suppose someone could rifle about thru all their booklets & see if it's all the same person for English subbing... foreign languages obviously require translators variegated). If there was a staff person for english & they truly are cutting this extra then that's just lousy business & a bit rude actually.

Given that a good chunk of Criterion titles are in a foreign language, I highly doubt they have one person handling all the subtitling. Most DVD companies have it done by an outside firm, yes at an hourly rate and I'm sure it all adds up considerably. But given their SRP hasn't dropped, I'm not sure I understand the logic of dumping subtitles unless it's increase per piece profit by a very marginal amount. I can't imagine subbing costs substantially more than producing/pulling together the extras on their discs.

[Napoleon]

I can't believe they are releasing this piece of shit instead of what they should be releasing.

This doesn't even have an entry on metacritic or imdb for fucks sake!

They should release:

Some Rivette
Rocco and His Brothers
Senso
more Ozu
The Eisenstein silent years box
Bottle Rocket

Because I think these will all look really great on my dvd shelf when I have some high-brow guests around for a few martini's. Like thats ever going to happen.






I have always associated lack of subtitles with poor quality DVDs. I frequently use them in tandem with sound when late night viewing.
They are damn near essential when watching Devil and Daniel Webster, which has (somewhat understandably) poor sound clarity. Another strange mis-step for the cc and a kick in the eye for the hard of hearing.