52-53 / BD 36 Ugetsu monogatari & Oyū-sama

Discuss releases by Eureka and Masters of Cinema and the films on them.
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Cabiria21
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#51 Post by Cabiria21 » Mon May 05, 2008 5:12 am

say Michael, do you have a list of the surviving Mizoguchi films, a quick google search brought up peanuts.

I'd like to know what of his (let's say pre-Utamaro) are surviving?

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Michael Kerpan
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#52 Post by Michael Kerpan » Mon May 05, 2008 8:51 am

Cabiria21 wrote:say Michael, do you have a list of the surviving Mizoguchi films, a quick google search brought up peanuts.

I'd like to know what of his (let's say pre-Utamaro) are surviving?
I think this all the pre-Utamaro films that survive (in even partial form):

Furusato no uta / The Song of Home (1925)
Tokyo koshin-kyoku / Tokyo March (1929) (digest version)
Asahi wa kagayaku (1929) (M was co-director, but the parts he directed don't seem to have been preserved)
Fujiwara Yoshie no furusato (1930)
Taki no shiraito / The Water Magician (1933)
Orizuru Osen / The Downfall of Osen (1935)
Maria no Oyuki / Oyuki the Virgin (1935)
Gubijinsô / Poppies (1935)
Ojo Okichi (1935) (M was co-director with Takashima Tatsunosuke)
Naniwa erejî / Osaka Elegy (1936)
Gion no shimai / Sisters of the Gion (1936)
Aien kyo / The Straits of Love and Hate (1937)
Zangiku monogatari / The Story of the Late Chrysanthemums (1939)
Genroku chushingura / The 47 Ronin (1941)
Miyamoto Musashi / Musashi Miyamoto (1944)
Meito bijomaru / The Famous Sword Bijomaru (1945)
Josei no shôri / The Victory of Women (1946)

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#53 Post by evillights » Sat Jun 14, 2008 6:22 pm

Michael Kerpan wrote:FWIW -- "Kozou" does NOT mean "brat", but just a youngster (or more specifically -- a young Buddhist monk).
Hi Michael --

I meant to respond to this a while back...

小僧
bantling〈古〉 // boy // nipper // servant boy // shaveling // squirt〈俗・軽蔑的〉〔生意気な若者や、体の小さいものに対して使われる。〕dickens〈俗〉 // mischievous child // monkey // naughty boy // ragamuffin(汚れた格好をした) // scamp // brat

子供に対してムカッと来たときなどに用いる言葉〕 // imp // limb〈話〉 // little turista // mischief // mischievous boy // mischievous rogue // naughty boy // rantipole〈古〉 // rascal // rogue // unruly boy // urchin(汚らしい身なりの)〈古〉

Obviously, the film has nothing to do with a young Buddhist monk... and does have much to do with a straightforward little 'brat'..

(As is probably known, Tokkan Kozô became the stage-name of the little boy whom we find cropping up again in Ozu's 'Passing Fancy', etc.)

craig.

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ltfontaine
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#54 Post by ltfontaine » Mon Jun 23, 2008 12:33 pm

Finally got around to Rayns’ comments on Oyu-sama, and have to agree that Tanaka is miscast in the title role, at least as compared to the way she is elaborately drawn in Tanizaki’s story as the fulfillment of Shinnosuke’s romantic ideal. It’s regrettable that Daiei would not allow retention of the story’s flashback structure, which could have been so beautifully rendered by Mizoguchi—and by Tanaka, for that matter, working with a script that more closely adhered to the source text.

Rayns does err in identifying Shinnosuke as the teller of Tanizaki’s story, which is actually told by an unnamed narrator who recounts the tale as told to him by Sinnosuke’s and Shuzi’s grown son, who likely exists, in turn, only in the narrator’s intoxicated imagination. The closing scenes of the film are a nod to the setting of the story—a reedy sandbar in the middle of a river from which the narrator watches the moon rise—momentarily evoking the ambience of a film that might have been.

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GringoTex
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#55 Post by GringoTex » Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:04 am

I just watched Oyu-sama and continue to be underwhelmed by Mizoguchi's contemporary films. What works about his broad painting of emotions in his historical films comes across as crass in his present-day films. Maybe I'm looking for "realism" where none exists.

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Michael Kerpan
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#56 Post by Michael Kerpan » Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:35 am

Genuine "realism" is never an aim in Mizoguchi -- whether in historic settings, Meiji ones (isn't Oyu-sama set in this period?) and contemporary ones. Visual poetry and good-old fashioned shimpa melodrama are always a lot more important than naturalism or realism. I don't think the temporal setting of Mizoguchi's films correlates at all with their value -- there are first-rate films and less-than-first-rate ones in all categories. Oyu-sama is a very lovely looking film, but I'd never put it into Mizoguchi's top tier of accomplishments. I wouldn't even rate it as highly as a film like Portrait of Madame Yuki )maybe even more gorgeous looking).

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GringoTex
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#57 Post by GringoTex » Wed Oct 29, 2008 6:02 pm

I expect psychological realism from a contemporary melodrama. But now you've told me it's somewhat of a period piece (I should have known by the style of the western men's suits). Still, it's not set far enough in the past to reach the "legend" stage, so I still need the psychological realism, and I don't think Mizoguchi is very good at it. Gion Bayashi is the only one I've seen so far that I've found completely satisfactory.

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Michael Kerpan
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#58 Post by Michael Kerpan » Wed Oct 29, 2008 8:09 pm

Mizoguchi's foundation is shimpa melodrama -- the first post-traditional type of drama to develop in Japan during the Meiju. It was a radical development when it first arose, but had already started to look old fashioned by 1910 or so, when the shingeki (new theater) movement arose. Shingeki was very influenced by the latest western developments (Ibsen and Chekhov et al). This is the movement that introduced realism to Japan's theaters (and to its cinemas -- when Shochiku adopted its principles, re-inforced by Stanislawskian methodology, in the early 20s).

While Mizoguchi was clearly affected by shingeki (one of his best 40s films -- Love of Sumako the Actress -- is about the first modern actress of Japan, who was the original centerpiece of shingeki), his heart and sensibilities always stayed very close to the world of shimpa.

One may not care much for Mizoguchi's films set in more contemporary times, but these really are founded on a pre-realist aesthetic tradition. So one simply can't expect to find much late 19th C. realism in these films.

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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#59 Post by CorstenoftheFunk » Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:56 pm

Is this DVD going out of print? I finally found it at an acceptable price but in many online stores it's out of stock and not expected back for a month.

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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#60 Post by peerpee » Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:09 pm

Not going out of print. Probably being re-pressed.

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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#61 Post by CorstenoftheFunk » Wed Aug 12, 2009 5:49 pm

Thanks for the information. This is the only Mizoguchi DVD from Masters of Cinema I don't have and I would have felt a bit incomplete if I couldn't get it.

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Chaplinesque
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#62 Post by Chaplinesque » Sun Oct 10, 2010 3:29 pm

Same here, does anyone (hopefully peerpee) know if this DVD will be re-pressed? Cause it's the end of 2010 and I cannot find MoC Ugetsu DVD anywhere on the net... I have the three other Mizoguchi sets from MoC, this one is so badly missing from the collection :)

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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#63 Post by peerpee » Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:28 am

email kevin@eurekavideo.co.uk to see if they still have a single copy. They're all being put together in a box-set in January.

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Florinaldo
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#64 Post by Florinaldo » Tue Oct 12, 2010 4:17 pm

peerpee wrote:email kevin@eurekavideo.co.uk to see if they still have a single copy. They're all being put together in a box-set in January.
Which may be why they turned up in nearly every monthly Eureka offers over the last few year (I got mine last February, for 9 pounds each, and saw them offered again in subsequent monthly announcements); Eureka may have intended to sell out their stock of individual discs.

It would be sad for someone to be left out with just that one title missing in the set, considering that the prices on Amazon.uk Marketplace are rather steep.

There may be a lesson in that: if there is a title that interests you in one of those sales, buy it now since you never know how long it will remain available.
Last edited by Florinaldo on Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Tommaso
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#65 Post by Tommaso » Tue Oct 12, 2010 4:56 pm

I have all the individual releases, but for those who haven't it might be interesting to know whether the box set will have all of those gorgeous booklets or whether it will be presented in a somewhat 'slimmer' way.

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knives
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#66 Post by knives » Tue Oct 12, 2010 7:09 pm

I'm mostly curious about the price. Is it likely to be in the same range as the Naruse set or will it be larger because of the higher number of films?

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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#67 Post by peerpee » Tue Oct 12, 2010 10:54 pm

The hardbox (like SHOAH, MABUSE, LUBITSCH) will contain four Amarays. They will be identical in every way to the versions currently available. Not sure it will be cost effective to organise a "send us £4 and we'll send you an empty outer box" scheme -- and those with a "fat spine" SANSHO would have problems. Bear with us, I'm trying to get METROPOLIS out the door, then I'll design this box... need to think about it a bit more.

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zedz
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#68 Post by zedz » Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:37 pm

I'm in the 'Fat Sansho' boat (not an Albert Serra reference), so I'd vote for two packaging-only options, if it's feasible. If not, no sweat.

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swo17
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#69 Post by swo17 » Wed Oct 13, 2010 11:53 am

I would gladly pay whatever it costs to get just the hardbox (no fat spine problems here).*

*That's what she said?

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Chaplinesque
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#70 Post by Chaplinesque » Wed Oct 13, 2010 3:10 pm

Florinaldo wrote: It would be sad for someone to be left out with just that one title missing in the set, considering that the prices on Amazon.uk Marketplace are rather steep.

There may be a lesson in that: if there is a title that interests you in one of those sales, buy it now since you never know how long it will remain available.
Well unfortunately that sad one is me :) But I'll stay pep, I'm happy to get my hands on three Mizoguchi sets and I just received my Mabuse Box Set yesterday, so things are going pretty well MoC wise... And BTW, peerpee, thank you for the response, I sent an e-mail, I'll wait and see. But I can live :) without completing my Mizoguchis since MoC team keeps creating wonderful DVDs (I'm looking forward to the 150 minute-long Metropolis and Die Nibelungen).

And Florinaldo, you're absolutely right about the lesson, there's no reason to wait if you want to buy an item...

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Chaplinesque
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#71 Post by Chaplinesque » Tue Oct 26, 2010 4:08 pm

peerpee wrote:email kevin@eurekavideo.co.uk to see if they still have a single copy. They're all being put together in a box-set in January.
Peerpee, I emailed Kevin like you said, and long story short, I am now holding a Masters of Cinema Ugetsu Monogatari DVD in my hands \:D/ Kevin was so kind to send me a copy of this DVD and now my Mizoguchi collection is complete... Finally :D Thanks a million for leading me to the right direction, couldn't be happier...

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swo17
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#72 Post by swo17 » Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:42 pm

Dual format coming in April, per MoC Twitter.

Could a mod please change the thread title to "BD 36 Ugetsu monogatari / Oyû-sama"?

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Michael Kerpan
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Re: 52-53 Oyu-sama and Ugetsu monogatari

#73 Post by Michael Kerpan » Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:51 pm

The one DVD of MOC's Mizoguchi series that I missed buying -- so an instant BR purchase. ;~}

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manicsounds
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Re: BD 36 Ugetsu monogatari / Oyû-sama

#74 Post by manicsounds » Mon Apr 23, 2012 8:27 am


Calvin
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Re: BD 36 Ugetsu monogatari / Oyû-sama

#75 Post by Calvin » Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:25 pm


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