Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Other Boutique Labels

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Twilight Time

#601 Post by EddieLarkin » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:37 pm

But it is a regular length feature film. It's only 8 minutes shorter than Hitchcock's Rope! If it was sub 1 hour then I'd be on board with what you're saying, and would expect them to at least make it a double feature with something else. But there's nothing unusual about a 70 minute film, especially from that period of film making.

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Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

Re: Twilight Time

#602 Post by Gregory » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:45 pm

knives wrote:
Gregory wrote:I thought we were talking about the main feature being relatively short (~70 minutes) which in my house often means it gets viewed sooner and more often than something 2-3 times that length.
I agree with that but, especially since I presume TT didn't have any additional costs like restoration, selling a short movie minus extras for the same as a regular length feature plus extras seems weird to me.
Does a licensor get any discount if the feature is shorter than average length? As for the extras, we'll just have to wait and see, but TT charging special-edition prices for a (near-)bare-bones release would hardly be anything out of the ordinary.

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knives
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2008 6:49 pm

Re: Twilight Time

#603 Post by knives » Tue Nov 26, 2013 9:56 pm

EddieLarkin wrote:But it is a regular length feature film. It's only 8 minutes shorter than Hitchcock's Rope! If it was sub 1 hour then I'd be on board with what you're saying, and would expect them to at least make it a double feature with something else. But there's nothing unusual about a 70 minute film, especially from that period of film making.
The Rope BD is MSRP $30 and can be found much cheaper than that. I'd say that would be a reasonable price for a new release.

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Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

Re: Twilight Time

#604 Post by Gregory » Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:02 pm

Complaints about pricing structure, however valid, should probably go in the "Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films" thread, to which many pages of this thread were already moved.

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EddieLarkin
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Re: Twilight Time

#605 Post by EddieLarkin » Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:13 pm

Sure, but Rope is not specially discounted because it has a short runtime. You can pick Gone with the Wind up for a similar bargain price.

As for Man in the Dark, it too will probably have a $30 MSRP like all other TT discs these days. They went for $35 with Major Dundee because it required two discs, but I don't think that will be necessary for Man in the Dark even allowing for the additional 3D version, precisely because of the short runtime.

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jindianajonz
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Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#606 Post by jindianajonz » Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:06 am

Whoever compared it to Night and Fog, this film is over twice the length of that one. A better comparison would be the 63 minute Most Dangerous Game, which had no special features and was priced at $25, though considering this is Blu-Ray, I think a slightly higher price would be excusable.

And who knows, maybe it'll be relatively loaded, in which case a $35 price would make it a better deal than Criterion's 70 minute Island of Lost Souls (you know, if you base your movie purchases only on run time, special features and price, and don't factor in trivial things like the quality of the movie itself)

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matrixschmatrix
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Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#607 Post by matrixschmatrix » Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:16 am

I'm sure Twilight Time is tired of being compared to Olive, but but Olive dropped the MSRP on their blu release of Anthony Mann's 56 minute Strangers in the Night to $25, $5 cheaper than their longer releases. Though honestly at 70 minutes, that's feature length- I don't know that one is owed anything for brevity there.

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Roger Ryan
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Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#608 Post by Roger Ryan » Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:25 am

Using Chico Marx economics, for some films you should pay more for being able to sit through a shorter running time: $35 for 70 minutes, $70 for 35 minutes, $100 for 15 minutes, etc.

Theoretical straight man: "What if I don't watch the film at all?"
Chico Marx: "You couldn't afford it."

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Moe Dickstein
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: Twilight Time

#609 Post by Moe Dickstein » Thu Mar 06, 2014 3:17 pm

Personally I think this demonstrates TT's commitment to bringing out a quality product for their price point. Time and again, they've shown a willingness to do things like this and adjust course to make a better product. Notice how many commentaries we're getting these days?

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TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
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Re: Twilight Time

#610 Post by TMDaines » Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:14 am

Twilight Time / SAE is a company that will sell their product at a greatly inflated price, but then offer to doctor their shipping labels so you don't have pay taxes on importing their product, (thus insuring the only money you spend ends up in their pocket) so they've got previous with their peculiar ethics in the hunt for your order.

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Moe Dickstein
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 11:19 pm

Re: Twilight Time

#611 Post by Moe Dickstein » Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:35 pm

I've read that last sentence 3 times and can't understand it...

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Twilight Time

#612 Post by EddieLarkin » Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:52 pm

TMDaines wrote:Twilight Time / SAE is a company that will sell their product at a greatly inflated price, but then offer to doctor their shipping labels so you don't have pay taxes on importing their product, (thus insuring the only money you spend ends up in their pocket)
You say this like it's some sort of advantage for SAE. They save you money, all of which stays in your pocket, not theirs.

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fdm
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Re: Twilight Time

#613 Post by fdm » Sat Mar 08, 2014 4:33 am

EddieLarkin wrote:
TMDaines wrote:Twilight Time / SAE is a company that will sell their product at a greatly inflated price, but then offer to doctor their shipping labels so you don't have pay taxes on importing their product, (thus insuring the only money you spend ends up in their pocket)
You say this like it's some sort of advantage for SAE. They save you money, all of which stays in your pocket, not theirs.
Besides that, Twilight Time and Screen Archives are two separate companies.

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NABOB OF NOWHERE
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Re: Twilight Time

#614 Post by NABOB OF NOWHERE » Sat Mar 08, 2014 7:26 am

EddieLarkin wrote:
TMDaines wrote:Twilight Time / SAE is a company that will sell their product at a greatly inflated price, but then offer to doctor their shipping labels so you don't have pay taxes on importing their product, (thus insuring the only money you spend ends up in their pocket)
You say this like it's some sort of advantage for SAE. They save you money, all of which stays in your pocket, not theirs.
Well I for one (in Europe) buy a shed load of CD soundtracks from SAE on which they mark down the declared value so it escapes what would otherwise be a very punitive import charge. Without this I would be forced to look elsewhere. So in that sense and I can hardly be alone on this they are benefiting from increased sales.

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EddieLarkin
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Re: Twilight Time

#615 Post by EddieLarkin » Sat Mar 08, 2014 11:04 am

God forbid they benefit from increased sales by saving international customers shed loads of fees (again, none of which goes to them).

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NABOB OF NOWHERE
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Re: Twilight Time

#616 Post by NABOB OF NOWHERE » Sat Mar 08, 2014 12:22 pm

EddieLarkin wrote:God forbid they benefit from increased sales by saving international customers shed loads of fees (again, none of which goes to them).
Why God Forbid.? if they didn't do what they do they wouldn't get the sales Is that not clear enough?

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EddieLarkin
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Re: Twilight Time

#617 Post by EddieLarkin » Sat Mar 08, 2014 1:26 pm

I'm not saying they do it out of the goodness of their heart, but they don't advertise or promote it. Anyone buying from SAE for the first time would expect fees, so clearly they still would get sales. Are we not in agreement that it is a good thing they do this?

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Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

Re: Twilight Time

#618 Post by Gregory » Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:20 pm

It's illegal and seems like a foolish thing to get a reputation for routinely doing as a company.

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NABOB OF NOWHERE
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Re: Twilight Time

#619 Post by NABOB OF NOWHERE » Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:47 pm

Gregory wrote:It's illegal and seems like a foolish thing to get a reputation for routinely doing as a company.
Don't grass us up Greg, I need those Morricone reissues without paying through the nose. They're dear enough as it is.

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EddieLarkin
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Re: Twilight Time

#620 Post by EddieLarkin » Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:04 pm

Gregory wrote:It's illegal and seems like a foolish thing to get a reputation for routinely doing as a company.
I'm under the impression they've been doing it for decades, so I guess despite it being illegal the various border forces don't seem to care so much. Flicker Alley, Diabolik DVD and Mondo Vision all do it as well (in the latter case, they literally do advertise the fact on their site!).

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Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#621 Post by Gregory » Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:28 pm

They do? I didn't think Mondo Vision even took orders on their site.

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EddieLarkin
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Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#622 Post by EddieLarkin » Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:50 pm

http://www.toufaan.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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TMDaines
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Re: Twilight Time

#623 Post by TMDaines » Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:20 pm

EddieLarkin wrote:
TMDaines wrote:Twilight Time / SAE is a company that will sell their product at a greatly inflated price, but then offer to doctor their shipping labels so you don't have pay taxes on importing their product, (thus insuring the only money you spend ends up in their pocket)
You say this like it's some sort of advantage for SAE. They save you money, all of which stays in your pocket, not theirs.
Of course it is an advantage for them. Otherwise their customers, in the UK for example, would have to factor in a likely 20% + £8 fee on their outlay on orders made at their site. They do it for the exact same reason Amazon's European stores don't charge VAT to non-EEA buyers. The VAT wouldn't need to be going to them either, but they save their customers money by reducing unnecessary fixed costs. The difference is one site's policy is legitimate practice; the other is illegal.
NABOB OF NOWHERE wrote:
Gregory wrote:It's illegal and seems like a foolish thing to get a reputation for routinely doing as a company.
Don't grass us up Greg, I need those Morricone reissues without paying through the nose. They're dear enough as it is.
That was the point I was making. They're willing to bleed you dry but are then more than happy to cover their tracks to the authorities over the amount their charging. It's a complete hypocrisy. I hate the Royal Mail fee in the UK, and thankfully I've never had to pay it so far, but the hypocrisy of them enticing overseas customers by offsetting their overpriced products through customs tax dodging is ludicrous.
Last edited by TMDaines on Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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swo17
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Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#624 Post by swo17 » Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:35 pm

TMDaines wrote:They're willing to bleed you dry but are then more than happy to cover their tracks to the authorities over the amount their charging. It's a complete hypocrisy.
Yes, they're lowering the stated value of their product on international orders out of fear that customs police are going to shut down their bleeding customers dry operation!

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TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
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Re: Business Models: Twilight Time vs. Olive Films

#625 Post by TMDaines » Sat Mar 08, 2014 5:38 pm

I'm sure you know what I meant! :lol:

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