279 Young Törless

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Martha
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279 Young Törless

#1 Post by Martha » Wed Dec 22, 2004 3:09 pm

Young Törless

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At an Austrian boys' boarding school in the early 1900s, shy, intelligent Törless observes the sadistic behavior of his fellow students, doing nothing to help a victimized classmate—until the torture goes too far. Adapted from Robert Musil's acclaimed novel, Young Törless launched the New German Cinema movement and garnered the 1966 Cannes Film Festival International Critics' Prize for first-time director Volker Schlöndorff.

Special Features

• New, restored digital transfer
• A German Movie, a new video interview with writer-director Volker Schlöndorff in which he reflects upon the making of Young Törless and its subsequent impact
• Rare presentation of the original score by acclaimed composer Hans Werner Henze, with a video introduction by Schlöndorff
• Stills gallery of behind-the-scenes production images and promotional art
• Original theatrical trailer
• New and improved English subtitle translation
• Plus: A new essay by film scholar Timothy Corrigan

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Narshty
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#2 Post by Narshty » Wed Dec 22, 2004 3:46 pm

I'm actually really looking forward to this. I've only seen those films of Schlondorff's that are currently in the collection, but I've got a hunch these sorts of intense character studies are his strength, because The Lost Honor of Katharina Blum and Coup de Grace are really solid, focused works, while the sprawling would-be epic The Tin Drum was an absolute mess.

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#3 Post by jesus the mexican boi » Wed Dec 22, 2004 3:49 pm

Loved THE TIN DRUM, but REALLY excited about YOUNG TORLESS. Reading Musil's novel was an amazing experience. I have heard the film cannot match Musil, and I don't expect it to, but am really looking forward to this. Cheers to Criterion for picking this up unexpectedly (at least as far as I'd heard).

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#4 Post by denti alligator » Wed Dec 22, 2004 3:54 pm

No, the film can't match Musil, but it is AMAZING. Unlike his failed attempt at filming another great German-language novel (Tin Drum).

I was just going to add speculation to the speculation thread on this one and am so thrilled.

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#5 Post by dvdane » Wed Dec 22, 2004 8:25 pm

No, the film can't match Musil

Actually I believe it can and does. Not as much a Musil Scholar as Denti, my field is more specified onto the book itself and its hypertextualism into film.

It is important to know, that Musil began writing T�rless partly out of boredom, partly out of the desire to write and finally because, in terms of genre, the school novel was hugely popular - I also believe that Musil chose the title to be a "play" with Goethe's "Die Leiden des jungen Werters" - because it suggests the drive and will Musil put into creating the novel, and thus also the conscious awareness of the structure and motifs.

The book has a curious structure, progessive linear in chapters, yet each chapter is mainly told in analepsis, by memories, anecdotes, observations, reflections and so on, spending the first 3rd introducing characters, its second 3rd the setup of plot and its final 3rd with the doubts of T�rless, set against the humiliations of Basini.

Important here are two passages: (1) the introductionary quote by Maeterlinck and (2) Beinbergs lecture about the Weltsehle, both directly demonstrating the books relationship with Transcendentalism. Musil pays direct homage, in terms of wordplay to Emerson's "Self Reliance", to Shaw's "Man and Superman" and to Nietzsche, and indirect homage to Baudelaire and von Hartmann.

The book is transcendentalism and as such existentialism, but also a direct critic of society. Make no mistake, this is one very important little book.

Schl�ndorrf breaks this structure up and makes it more progressive, but remains the analepsis in regards to Beinberg and Basini. What Schl�ndorff wants is to show that how as childish cruelty was accepted because it didn't collide with the mindless conformity automatically created super- and subhumans, where humilations, even torture, were tools for both discipline and future leadership, and how these in turns caused the rise of the third reich.

Where Musil always had a personal reason for punishment, does Schl�ndorff not, which makes the decay and fall of the social values, by Schl�ndorff societies democratic powerdivision, even stronger, as there need to be no reason, or as said in his defence speech, that any man can do any evil, no matter how evil, just like that, and it will be completely naturel.

While this may be a misprint, it also may not be.

Criterion states the presentation to be 1.75:1 Anamorphic, which suggests the image being cropped, as the OAR was 1.66:1,

solent

#6 Post by solent » Thu Dec 23, 2004 11:12 pm

I knew this was coming out in the CC earlier this year but I still couldn't wait so I bought the video. The HVE transfer is excellent and I'm not bothered if the DVD is the same but I'm sure it will be better. This release makes one wish for more German "New Wave" classics by Kluge et. al. Other unknown films from the 66-70 period seem to be almost non-existent in terms of film prints and videos, let alone DVDs.

As a first feature this film is brilliant. I like to compare it to Vigo's ZERO and Anderson's IF... All three films seem to share common themes despite their stylistic differences.

For those of you considering a blind buy: go for it - you won't be dissapointed.

p.s. The film score by Hans Werner Henze is particularly good.

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#7 Post by denti alligator » Mon Jan 31, 2005 12:46 pm

From the CC site:
Original Recording of Henze's Landmark Score to Appear on Young Törless

Criterion's upcoming DVD edition of Volker Schlöndorff's breakthrough film Young Törless will feature composer Hans Werner Henze's original, February 1966 recording of the score for the film, with a special video introduction by the director. This rare recording features the ancient instruments—such as the drehleier and the viola d'amore—for which the music was originally written. Henze subsequently rewrote the score for traditional orchestral instruments. Look for Young Törless in March.

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#8 Post by oldsheperd » Thu Mar 03, 2005 12:34 pm

Back is up at dvdempire

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dvdane
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#9 Post by dvdane » Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:30 pm

It is great that Criterion adds the original score, as it is a treat. Especially the drehleier has a sound of someone pulling the tail of a cat, which gives the film a unique rural atmosphere. The orchestral score has replaced this with a cello, so I believe, and while it is a nice piece of score, the entire atmosphere was gone when it was altered.

However, Critirion has cropped the image, which is becoming more the rule than the exception.

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#10 Post by denti alligator » Fri Mar 04, 2005 2:00 pm

However, Critirion has cropped the image, which is becoming more the rule than the exception.
How bad is it? Are we talking 2% or 15%?

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dvdane
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#11 Post by dvdane » Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:45 pm

From 1.66:1 to 1.78:1 is 7,23%. What matters here are two things. First of all, Criterions own policy, which states,
Criterion wrote:Each film is presented uncut, in its original aspect ratio, as its maker intended it to be seen.
secondly, that the film was composed for 1.66:1 and by reducing the frame, there will be some medium shots where the headspace will be compromised. Some ten years ago, the germans restored the film and later screened it in 1.66:1 with the original score. So why Criterion insists on cropping the image is highly questionable.

It not only technical possible to produce a 16x9 transfer of a 1.66:1 image, its simply an option.

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#12 Post by denti alligator » Fri Mar 04, 2005 7:02 pm

Wouldn't it be Schloendorff's option, since this disc is director approved?

I mean at least it's listed as being 1.75:1, unlike the Marriage of Maria Brown and Discreet Charm of the Bourgeoisie discs, which are listed at 1.66:1 and cropped to 1.78:1 and Criterion still denies it.

solent

#13 Post by solent » Fri Mar 04, 2005 9:15 pm

At times like these it pays to compare the HVe 1.66:1 version to this new one. I predict the result would not be as jarring as say a comparison between the 1.33:1 MGM SHAME to the 1.66:1 version (frames of which still exist in the featurette as an extra). This sort of cropping is more obvious.

It is interesting to know if "Director approved" really means the director has a final choice in terms of DVD formatting or whether it applies to the film preservation transfer alone. I would plug both since DVD is a vewing medium and it would be naive of Criterion to expect Schlondorrf not to see and own a copy of the final product. After all, he is the artist and it is his choice.

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#14 Post by FilmFanSea » Tue Mar 08, 2005 1:19 pm

DVD Beaver Review (which calculates the AR as 1.70:1---as if they split the difference between 1.66 and 1.75)

I've been on the fence about buying this one, but I think I'll take the plunge.

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ola t
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#15 Post by ola t » Tue Mar 08, 2005 2:44 pm

How is the "rare presentation" of the original score actually presented? Is it a supplement or is it on the regular audio track?

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#16 Post by mbalson » Tue Mar 08, 2005 6:52 pm

It's presented separately as a supplement.

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#17 Post by jorencain » Thu Mar 17, 2005 12:17 am

Wow-what a nice surprise this was. I wasn't expecting anything quite this dark, but it's a really good film. Yes, these kids speak much more articulately than any schoolkids I know, and the "message" of the film is spelled out a little bit more blatantly than it probably needed to be, but these are things that I can forgive. I didn't know if Törless' classmates reminded me more of Lars Von Trier, Hitler, or the cast of "Salo." Anyway, it's an interesting case study, and a great debut film for Schlöndorff.

I am not quite sure why the soundtrack is offered as a separate extra because all the music seems to be in the film as well. I may be missing something though. I haven't watched the Schlöndorff interview yet, but I'm looking forward to it. I'm liking him more and more with each film I see.

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keeproductions
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#18 Post by keeproductions » Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:16 am

I'm liking him more and more with each film I see.
Me too. Good thing I started with Palmetto. It could only go up from there....

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#19 Post by colinr0380 » Mon Apr 11, 2005 5:52 am

A very good film - I thought that the metaphor was well done. It is interesting that you have the 'ideological' student (as Schlondorff labels him) who is the catalyst for the torture taking advantage of a situation by pushing Basini into his petty crime of stealing and then using it as an excuse for punishment that soon goes beyond the crime, and the student who is more the 'muscle' in his alliance with the ideologist and who is able to keep the 'regime' going (and is also the first to rape Basini). It seems that the film is showing that as long as one person has the idea and the muscle to back it up then they can begin to create a larger situation in which they are in control.

The interesting aspect of this film is how the intellectual Torless is co-opted into the torture. He may be sticking with the other two because he is afraid of them turning on him and their power (as they demonstrate when they threaten him in the dorm room), and in order to avoid having to take action he may try to justify his participation by taking an intellectual approach to trying to understand good and evil. But this is only my interpretation - his intellectual approach may be completely without ulterior motives of fear.

But he is still involved - even if he limits his involvement to watching as Basini is beaten or 'hypnotised', he actually starts a new cycle of humiliation by getting Basini to repeat "I am a thief". Actually when he says that, he seem to be briefly caught up in enjoying the power over Basini and I think this evil he realises within himself is something that troubles him more perhaps than the torture (making his running away near the end of the film rather sad - how can you run away from something you feel inside yourself? His being expelled also suggests that this is the school masters running away from confronting these issues themselves, taking the easy way out). So even though Torless does not go to such extremes as the other two and limits himself to getting Basini to make a true, if humiliating, statement about himself, he still gives Beineberg ammunition to pick up and run with, getting Basini to make more explicitly humiliating statements about himself.

Thinking of Beineberg and Reiting being the ideology and muscles of the regime, it is interesting that they co-opt Torless to provide the intellectual legitimacy to what they do. It seems like they need Torless and his attributes in the same way that a regime like the Nazis collected art and made films like the one on the M disc elevating themselves above the cruelty and horror that they perpetrated to create a perception of themselves in a cultured, correct, 'knowing what is best' ruling body (I think a modern political term would be to place a 'spin' on events), or the way that in George Orwell's 1984 the hero is employed changing the intellectual content and context of the past to fit the needs of the present - the intellectual can justify actions by using their intelligence for the furtherance of a regime.

If Torless left would Beineberg and Reiting immediately stop what they are doing? Probably not, but the presence of Torless lends this sense of legitimacy to their actions and the respect that other students may have for his intelligence may lead them to think that their actions are not particularly wrong since Torless is aware of and therefore seems to support it (at least until the gym scene, but by that stage the massed force of the pupils has been whipped up into too much of a frenzy to be stopped by one person alone)

So the ideology, muscles and intellect have started to exert their control over the mass of the students by giving them people to look up to (whether you prefer to be a ruler, part of the more 'hands on' group torturing a mouse, or take an intellectual approach to good and evil - all views are represented, all are tainted by guilt for the actions in the film) and a victim to blame for all their problems. A victim that you can dehumanise to being just a thief if you ignore the way he was forced into that situation by circumstances created by those now calling him a thief (I'm sure we can think of many historical situations where people or groups have been repressed to an extent that if they make a false move that can then be capitalised upon as 'proof' that they deserve their treatment by their oppressors).

This seems like an excellent film with its questions of how both good and evil can exist within human nature and how tenuous the legitimacy of society and its institutions are to being pressed into a cruel use - they are only as 'good' as the people running them and can even have good people caught up in evil acts, and trying to justify their participation. Torless may have learnt an intellectual lesson about always being on your guard, but his (lack of) action when it was needed spoke more to his ability to put his intellect into action.

Watching the trailer I noticed that there were a number of alternate angles or takes of scenes such as that of the Barbara Steele kiss which is a one shot from behind Torless in the film but in the trailer has him facing Bozena. Another alternate angle is a more explicit close up of Basini showing Torless his wounds in the field - I guess this was dropped in order to keep the fluidity of the tracking shot or perhaps to place us in Torless's shoes of trying not to become too emotionally involved with Basini. It also looks like a shot that could be dropped into the scene and therefore perhaps it was a case of Schlondorff making a more explicit shot of Basini's wounds in case he felt it was needed. I'm not sure, but it is interesting to speculate on the circumstances.

The other difference in the trailer is the gutting of the pig that Torless walks past at the beginning of the film - in the film the man is pulling the pigs guts out and putting them in the bucket during the walk past. In the trailer the man is only just making the first cut and exposes the guts just as he is obscured by the wall. I'm not sure why there would need to be two versions of this - is there some point being made by seeing the guts going into the bucket or perhaps it was just chosen because it was a more visceral image? (One of the things I do not particularly like in the film is the use of animal violence to put across the point - I don't think the fly or the mouse were going to die before they were squashed and smashed against a wall, so I don't think these would pass a test that the BBFC might make about cruelty, unless the mouse was ingeniously faked - it does remind me a little of a similar scene in Ratcatcher though when the mouse could stand for the power that the kids in the films are beginning to realise that they can wield).

Also I found an easter egg on the disc. Go to the interview with Schlondorff and down to the index button. Then press left and a box should appear over Schlondorff's eyes in the picture at the bottom of the screen. This leads to a picture of Schlondorff when he was at boarding school himself and presumably the same age as the characters shown in the film.

solent

#20 Post by solent » Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:14 pm

I noticed the different takes in the trailer and film with the fly on the paper shot but you are more observant than me in noticing the others. This makes me wonder why the director/editor would use deleted footage to make a trailer? I've noticed this in other trailers but not many (and the names escape me at present). Now all we need is contemporary films by directors like Kluge and we can enjoy a new phase of CC releases [in regard to the New German Cinema period - we hope].

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#21 Post by Harry White » Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:48 pm

thanks for the easter egg!

just watched this one tonight -- my first from Schlondorff. i also recently bought The Tin Drum but haven't watched it yet.

why do good men allow bad things to happen? because they can, and its easy.

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Re: 279 Young Törless

#22 Post by HistoryProf » Sun Feb 14, 2010 4:50 pm

Watched this last night and was quite impressed....all the more so after watching the interview with Schlondorff (if you haven't - do it) - of particular note was the kid that played Basini was actually a Polish Jew. Volker had decided to use non-actors for the majority of the roles and went to a school to try and find kids to play the parts. He asked them to point out the "outsider" no one liked - and it was the single jewish immigrant they chose. Adds a measure of veracity to it all that's really chilling.

I also laughed when he explained the response at Cannes - the audience loved it with one exception: the German cultural minister stood up half way through and yelled "This is NOT A GERMAN FILM!!" and left as loudly as possible....an interesting anecdote clearly illustrates the measures of denial post war Germany forced upon itself that Schlondorff was trying to confront. While Torless's speech at the end was a bit *too* obvious -- it really isn't meant for us, it was meant for Germany.

Finally...how crazy is it that his deskmate at a french boarding school in the 1950s was Bertrand Tavernier??!?? Stories like that always blow me away...

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Re: 279 Young Törless

#23 Post by Fortisquince » Sun Feb 14, 2010 7:22 pm

I couldn't agree more. A fantastic film that I've meant to post about here before. Alas, it's been four or five years since I've seen it, so I don't have much to say at the moment. I'll have to pick it up during the next, much-rumored sale on B&N.

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Re: 279 Young Törless

#24 Post by TMDaines » Thu Mar 02, 2017 1:16 pm

Is the extra relating to the "original" score on this disc just an isolated score chapter marked, plus a video introduction by the director? The same "original" score is in the main audio track for the film too right?

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